6th Match - England v Pakistan

[mr_mister]

Don't think batting/bowling first was really a factor in the result either today or yesterday's match tbqh. Bangladesh and Pakistan just played better that their oppoistion

Nah, scoreboard pressure/runs on the board in world cups is absolutey a thing. Many, many examples

 

[trundler]

Wood bowled decently at times. Stokes was uninspiring. Moeen was good. The rest were utterly ****. Sarfraz did well to get the 10 overs from Hafeez and Malik out of the way early on.

 

[smash84]

I am shocked.

I wasn't gambhiring this time tbh. I really thought England would canter to a win.

 

[wpdavid]

England can probably chase down anything on their day, but today's bowling effort has revealed a few chinks. And even this English side doesn't want to be regularly chasing 320+ in a World Cup environment.

The chinks in our bowling have been evident for ages, not that it's easy to suggest what to do about them. Plunkett and Curran may be an upgrade on what we saw today, but not by much. Perhaps we should think carefully about whether Rashid should be an automatic pick though; his more recent performances haven't been great. The thing that struck me for the first time today was how badly our batting tails off after number 6, especially given Moeen's decline. We really lack a couple of big hitters at 7 and 8, but that won't be rectified easily either. Obviously I'm not suggesting that Buttler drops a place in the order.

Anyway, very well played Pakistan, and I hope that their followers here enjoy their celebrations tonight. They thoroughly deserved the win.

 

[wrongun]

Nah, scoreboard pressure/runs on the board in world cups is absolutey a thing. Many, many examples

Yea its a different vibe and pressure. It is very different than playing in a bilateral ODI that means nothing. No way to prove it but I have noticed that England players were more calculative with their strokes in those than today. I'm sure a few demons crept in. Jason Roy and Moeen Ali let England down today. Pakistan bowled well and eventually things balanced out. Root should have gone earlier but then got out to a flaccid stroke.

 

[Bijed]

We really lack a couple of big hitters at 7 and 8, but that won't be rectified easily either. Obviously I'm not suggesting that Buttler drops a place in the order.

Anyway, very well played Pakistan, and I hope that their followers here enjoy their celebrations tonight. They thoroughly deserved the win.

You certainly wouldn't want him at 7 but Curran has impressed me with the bat recently so as long as his bowling turns out to be alright having him around will be useful in that regard. Agree that Rashid has fallen away after being pretty good for a while, but he's earned himself a bit of leeway given that I can't imagine we'd want to go in without a spinner and I'm not sure there's any particularly inspiring options out there? I know Mo but, nothwithstanding that he got 3-fer today, he's not a massive wicket-taking option, which is the role Rashid fills (even when not necessarily bowling too well)

 

[Top_Cat]

Can't really go after England's batting. Topped 300 in both their games. A couple of bats are aren't in perfect nick but they're doing pretty well. A bit stop-start perhaps but damn.

Personally wonder whether Woakes is working as the straight man to Jofra. Woakes bowls best when he's trying to move the ball, barely got one off the straight against South Africa and Pakistan took liberties with him today they wouldn't were he shooting for swing. Not saying the combo should change but a guy like Woakes is a far worse bowler when he's not looking for wickets. Blokes like Rashid and Ali are also far less effective in a bowling unit where they have to pull back a bad start.

 

[Dissector]

I really like the effect of these upsets in the context of the new format. It's thrown the tournament wide open and unlike recent World Cups it looks like most games will matter without the usual run of pointless early games. Afghanistan looks quite capable of pulling an upset too.

 

[Zinzan]

As I said they might be the best side, but I don't think they'll win the WC England.

I can see that same thing happening in a knock-out for them. Beings favourites at home with all that expectation is NOT easy.

 

[weldone]

So England won the toss and decided to lose.

 

[vcs]

They're a strong side but like India 2011, not a historically great outfit by any stretch. Depends on how they handle the pressure moments and knockouts (assuming they get there).

The good thing about that Indian team was that, even with a very average attack, Zaheer, Dhoni's captaincy, and Yuvraj's inexplicable troll wickets in the middle overs were enough to keep opposition batting lineups from running away from us.

 

[fredfertang]

What is it with England and World Cups?

 

[smash84]

They're a strong side but like India 2011, not a historically great outfit by any stretch. Depends on how they handle the pressure moments and knockouts (assuming they get there).

The good thing about that Indian team was that, even with a very average attack, Zaheer, Dhoni's captaincy, and Yuvraj's inexplicable troll wickets in the middle overs were enough to keep opposition batting lineups from running away from us.

Dhoni is an ATG LO captain. His leadership over the years has been exceptional. Probably the single biggest factor in India winning that WC.

 

[NUFAN]

Take a bow Mo Hafeez, I was shocked to see him at 4 but he produced an exceptional knock. Morgan had a poor game which is his norm in World cups (after a good first game).

Englands bowling unit didnt work at all. I thought that Curran was showing he was up to the challenge, Woakes is now looking like bowling is his third string.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Seen none of it but well done Pakistan. Roll on Thursday and a few days off and a chance to see some cricket.

 

[NUFAN]

Burgey a chasing team got within 20 of winning. I have to say though, the main point that you were making has held true.. Chasing is tougher compared to the usual ODI.

 

[Top_Cat]

tbh after the way Pakistan folded against Oshane Thomas, wouldn't have been a skipper alive who wouldn't have strongly considered putting them in. Some teams just have a day out.

 

[Arachnodouche]

After seeing the Pakistani batsmen handle the short ball so much better today, I wonder whether the likes of Oshane Thomas and Andre Russell bowl heavier deliveries. Woods and Archer though pacy feel skiddier and a product of rhythm whereas the West Indians because of their height seem to get the ball to bounce alarmingly off slightly fuller lengths. Would be interesting to compare the pitch map between the two attacks,

 

[Burgey]

The only interest left in this game is the applicability of Burgey’s 2nd Law.

Close enough.

 

[Beamer]

After seeing the Pakistani batsmen handle the short ball so much better today, I wonder whether the likes of Oshane Thomas and Andre Russell bowl heavier deliveries. Woods and Archer though pacy feel skiddier and a product of rhythm whereas the West Indians because of their height seem to get the ball to bounce alarmingly off slightly fuller lengths. Would be interesting to compare the pitch map between the two attacks,

This is my theory. Russell and Cotterel bowl heavy balls whilst Oshane, Holder and Carlos are all 6"6 or more.