Rank the 4 great all rounders of the 1980s from best to worst

[Lillian Thomson]

1. Botham. The most gifted all around cricketer in history.
2. Imran. Unlike Botham made the maximum use of his talent and turned himself into a useful batsman in the second half of his career.
3. Hadlee. Best bowler of the lot but as a batsman nothing more than a lower order hitter.
4. Kapil Dev. Hello Kapil.

 

[Migara]

Imran, Hadlee, Kapil, Botham

 

[bagapath]

4. Kapil Dev. Hello Kapil.

I dont get you. do you mean to say Kapil doesnt belong in this group?

 

[Lillian Thomson]

I dont get you. do you mean to say Kapil doesnt belong in this group?

No I wasn't implying that. He was a better batsman than Hadlee but in any other batting/bowling comparison with the other three he's at the bottom of the pile.

 

[G.I.Joe]

Doesn't Kapil have the best record against the West Indies? Inzamam, Donald and Kallis's (?) inferior record against Australia is often used against them to place them below the likes of Lara. Tendulkar, Ponting etc.

 

[Ikki]

I used to vote Botham, but after Subshakerz showed me how good Imran was in the 80s as a bowler (arguably better than everyone, even Marshall and Hadlee) I think that's enough to put him ahead. Botham is the better batsman but he lacked longevity.

 

[vic_orthdox]

I must admit, I chuckle a bit when people have that criticism of Imran not doing it all at the same time, and then people quote statistics over 10 years where he had fantastic figures. That doesn't necessarily mean at the same time, its a whole ten year period!

EDIT: Not arguing either way, just find it a humorous anomaly.

 

[Uppercut]

I must admit, I chuckle a bit when people have that criticism of Imran not doing it all at the same time, and then people quote statistics over 10 years where he had fantastic figures. That doesn't necessarily mean at the same time, its a whole ten year period!

EDIT: Not arguing either way, just find it a humorous anomaly.

Haha yeah, thought the same.

I probably shouldn't have brought that line of argument up anyway. I don't personally buy it. It's just the only possible criticism I can think of. Imran was seriously ****ing good.

 

[Uppercut]

Nah, even as a bias Kiwi I rank Beefy ahead of Hadlee if we're judging them purely as all-rounders for reasons made in my previous post

Opinions of Beefy are always the most polarised. Personally I prefer to look at a player's whole career rather than the brief period when they were at their best. Hadlee never turned into a joke.

 

[bagapath]

lets first of all put it on record that these are not good or very good cricketers. they are not even simply great. they are beyond that; they are absolute legends.

if you take the four of them and add lillee and marshall and dujon. richards and g.chappell and gavaskar and greenidge, you have THE team of the 80s that no one would have liked to face.

 

[vic_orthdox]

In reply to what I said earlier, I thought I'd have a peek at a year by year basis. Over Imran's career, he has the following calendar years where his batting average was >30, and his bowling <30.

1980: 351 runs @ 31.90, 1 x 50, 1 x 100; 30 wickets @ 21.46, 3 x 5WI.
1982: 393 runs @ 49.12, 2 x 50; 62 wickets @ 13.29, 5 x 5WI.
1983: 324 runs @ 108.00, 2 x 50, 1 x 100; 26 wickets @ 15.80, 3 x 5WI.
1985: 69 runs @ 34.5, 1 x 50; 17 wickets @ 15.94, 1 x 5WI.
1987: 515 runs @ 57.22, 2 x 50, 2 x 100; 29 wickets @ 29.2, 2 x 5WI.
1990: 430 runs @ 61.42, 3 x 50, 1 x 100; 8 wickets @ 27.62.

The ones that I've bolded are seriously good all-round years. You could get picky in 1985, saying that he only scored 69 runs for the calndar year, and in 1990, where he only took 8 wickets in six games.

In comparison to Beefy...

1978: 597 runs @ 39.8, 1 x 50, 3 x 100; 66 wickets @ 18.19, 5 x 5WI.
1979: 446 runs @ 37.16, 2 x 50, 1 x 100; 42 wickets @ 20.73, 4 x 5WI.
1980: 437 runs @ 31.21, 1 x 50, 2 x 100; 35 wickets @ 23.37, 2 x 5WI.
1983: 319 runs @ 31.90, 1 x 50, 1 x 100; 15 wickets @ 30.00
1985: 250 runs @ 31.25, 2 x 50; 31 wickets @ 27.58, 1 x 5WI.

With 1983 being a bit of an asterisk, as he averaged bang on 30. Also, the Beef man did a lot of his damage against WSC affected teams, unless I'm much mistaken. FTR, in 1981, where he did the damage to Australia in the Ashes, his figures were:

629 runs @ 28.59, 3 x 50, 2 x 100; 62 wickets @ 25.54, 4 x 5WI.

 

[jboss]

lets first of all put it on record that these are not good or very good cricketers. they are not even simply great. they are beyond that; they are absolute legends.

if you take the four of them and add lillee and marshall and dujon. richards and g.chappell and gavaskar and greenidge, you have THE team of the 80s that no one would have liked to face.

Call me biased but why no procter? I feel this guys has been misunderstood ans cannot believe that someone on these forums called him a "batting" all rounder.

The man had a glorious talent and would have been up there with Sobers had he had a full international record.

 

[GIMH]

I'm a believer that if a player has a period of greatness of a few years, then you can vote for them on the basis of that. Obviously if it's just a freak season or whatever, maybe not, but it's not like Botham only had one great series.

Obviously it's still close between Botham and Imran and I can understand people voting either way, but I can't really fathom Botham being ranked 4th out of the 4 as he clearly had the most ability (IMO ).

 

[bagapath]

Call me biased but why no procter? I feel this guys has been misunderstood ans cannot believe that someone on these forums called him a "batting" all rounder.

we have been consistently following test records to rank players. it is unfortunate that procter didnt get to have a full test career. but he played too little international cricket to be ranked with these guys.

 

[jboss]

IMHO Procters record can be jusged on his FC career like any of these greats. He played county cricket vs and allong with many greats and many of his wickets in SA were at a time of great SA batsman in the FC competition there: Cook, Pollock, Amm, Rushmere, Rice, Richards, Wessels to name a few.

 

[Uppercut]

We're talking about great test all-rounders, I thought.

 

[silentstriker]

Imran
Hadlee
Botham
Dev

Hadlee's bowling superiority more than makes up for his batting deficiency compared to the others.

Dunno, by that line of thought, you could say Marshall was the best all rounder. He was no mug with the bat, and his bowling made up for a lot too...

I'd say if I had to pick someone purely for one series and they'd be guaranteed to be at their peak, I'd go: Botham, Imran, Hadlee, Dev.

If I was a minnow and I had to pick one guy to build a team around for the next 10 years, I'd go: Imran, Hadlee, Dev, Botham. Dev ahead of Botham because of the longetivity that you'd need for someone you can hang on to for a decade.

Purely as allrounders (the question OP is asking), and over their whole careers: Imran, Botham, Dev, Hadlee.

 

[Black_Warrior]

Imran Khan for me was a few notches above the rest. Hadlee was a more consistent bowler but his batting as has been mentioned earlier, does not really compare with the rest.
Botham was more gifted as a batsman but Imran made more use of his talent and skill IMO.

I would rate him over Gary Sobers too because I admit that the only player I am totally biased about is Imran Khan. He got me into cricket, so he will always be a special player for me, more special than the rest.

 

[subshakerz]

I'm a believer that if a player has a period of greatness of a few years, then you can vote for them on the basis of that. Obviously if it's just a freak season or whatever, maybe not, but it's not like Botham only had one great series.

I disagree with this, for me one of the hallmarks of a great cricketer is producing the goods for a long period, at least a decade. Otherwise Waqar Younis would be the greatest fast bowler ever based on 90-94 and Hussey would be the best after Bradman based on 2005-08.

I also find that the greatness of Botham's peak is a bit overstated. Amazing though it was, most of the sides he faced had lost their Packer players and in nine tests against the West Indies he failed with both bat and ball (captaincy is no excuse).

 

[Prince EWS]

For those who like to compare peaks, this is how the ICC ratings site rated each player's peak as an allrounder:

Botham - 646
Imran - 518
Hadlee - 483
Kapil - 433
Procter - 217 (just for jboss )