"I didn't bowl your little outswingers"

[Manee]

Thompson is estimated at 170kph by some of the more optimistic and he is generally accepted as the fastest since Tyson. The question I pose is why was he so fast? Was he a physical marvel of brute strength or did the action activate more muscles than any other? He also does not seem to travel in straight lines, he ends up on the left edge of the pitch beside the playing strip, something which no fast bowler today does. Does modern coaching prevent the natural and yet, so very unnatural nature of Thompson's action?

I watched some of his deliveries and I fully believe that he bowled a lot of balls in the mid 150kph range but it is his quicker ball or effort ball which broke all prior limits. One particular bouncer from him which reached the batsman before he could sway out of the way (luckily, it was not on course to hit him and so his sway did not seem quite as superfluous) and reached the keeper above head height. When he hit the right length, he seemed to get a mix of vertical and horizontal speed like no other.

Truly a fast bowling marvel.

 

[Burgey]

Zahid was surely quicker then Shoaib, have heard many ex players who played against both say that Zahid was faster and that too bu a considerable distance with Brian Lara stating he's the fastest he ever came up against.

Mohd Akram was sharp but not in Zahid's range, I would classify him as an even more ill-disciplined Steve Harmison.

Did Zahid play in the test where Tubby got 334? IIRC Shoaib did, but unsure about Zahid. If they did, it shows raw pace just doen't do it without class as well.

 

[Richard]

He did (though he only bowled 16 overs in said Taylor-knock innings). IIRR that would've been after he'd lost some pace due to some injury or other.

Either way, obviously you're quite right that pace is little use without class. Think some people thought Zahid might have had some of that too, though I know little to nothing about him (I only saw him play 1 match, this one, by which time he was not much but a joke).

 

[Migara]

Did Zahid play in the test where Tubby got 334? IIRC Shoaib did, but unsure about Zahid. If they did, it shows raw pace just doen't do it without class as well.

That's not the point we are talking about.

 

[Days of Grace]

Absolute load of rubbish that Thommo could bowl 180 km/h. l.m.f.a.o. at all of you who believe this aussie twit. Sure, maybe 165 peak, but 180 km/h?? g.t.f.o.o.h!!!!

What else do you expect from an australian. They exaggerate everything and really they are just talking out of a whole in their ass.

 

[pasag]

Absolute load of rubbish that Thommo could bowl 180 km/h. l.m.f.a.o. at all of you who believe this aussie twit. Sure, maybe 165 peak, but 180 km/h?? g.t.f.o.o.h!!!!

What else do you expect from an australian. They exaggerate everything and really they are just talking out of a whole in their ass.

We can do without such generalisations, cheers.

 

[Captain Cricket]

Anyone know Lillee's pace during the peak of his career?

 

[Evermind]

Absolute load of rubbish that Thommo could bowl 180 km/h. l.m.f.a.o. at all of you who believe this aussie twit. Sure, maybe 165 peak, but 180 km/h?? g.t.f.o.o.h!!!!

.

My sentiments exactly. No way he got anywhere near 180 or even 170 IMO. His fastest was probably 165 or thereabouts.

 

[Captain Cricket]

I still think the West Indies of the 70's-80's were the quickest though..

 

[Burgey]

That's not the point we are talking about.

Oooh sorry.

It's pretty relevant though that a bloke like Taylor took two blokes whose pace was supposedly so great for 334, whereas as blokes like Richards, Lloyd and others used words like "scary" and "dangerous" and "being in a war" in relation to facing Thomson.

BTW, I agree that there's probably no way he bowled at 180 clicks. It's just so much faster than anything anyone else has ever been clocked at that it's unrelaistic imo. I could see him having bowled in the 160s though, and done it probably more consistently than others.

On Lillee, pre-back injury his pace was apparently pretty damn quick. Sobers commented ont eh world XI tour here in the early 70s that, as soon as he saw Lillee bowling in the early stages "my thoughts turned straight to Perth", and described seeing him for the 1st time as an "awesome sight". I think it was Wisden in 1972 that said he had real, genuine speed of the kind which "made the crowds gasp" or some such over-wrought twaddle which they usually came out with.

 

[Goughy]

On Lillee, pre-back injury his pace was apparently pretty damn quick. Sobers commented ont eh world XI tour here in the early 70s that, as soon as he saw Lillee bowling in the early stages "my thoughts turned straight to Perth", and described seeing him for the 1st time as an "awesome sight". I think it was Wisden in 1972 that said he had real, genuine speed of the kind which "made the crowds gasp" or some such over-wrought twaddle which they usually came out with.

Yeah that WACA game he destroyed the Rest of the World XI.

Sobers came into bat and couldnt believe how far back Marsh was standing.

"What are you doing back there?"

"You wait, you'll find out"

Sobers then describes the first ball he recieved as "I'd never seen anything like it"

Lillee took 8-29 in that innings.

The interesting thing is that he was obviously pdq when he was young before the bad back but was the superior bowler over the long term after the hard work of re-modelling himself into an artful speedy fast/medium bowler.

 

[Top_Cat]

Sobers then describes the first ball he recieved as "I'd never seen anything like it"

So he did see it? Can't have been too quick then.

And surely everyone knows that you never ask Thommo about factual stuff. The man is a walking FUD factory and I find it extremely unlikely he bowled anywhere near where he says he did.

Interesting to see the contrasting opinions of humble vs not-so-humble quicks. Thommo reckons he bowled up to 180km/h, eh? I do remember Michael Holding watching Shaoib Akhtar in the 1999 WC and exclaiming that he never bowled as quick as that. As much as Holding under-rates his speed, I think Thommo over-rates his speed and shows you can't trust the opinions of people who are merely watching the game because it's impossible to tell just by watching.

 

[Goughy]

Interesting to see the contrasting opinions of humble vs not-so-humble quicks. Thommo reckons he bowled up to 180km/h, eh? I do remember Michael Holding watching Shaoib Akhtar in the 1999 WC and exclaiming that he never bowled as quick as that. As much as Holding under-rates his speed, I think Thommo over-rates his speed and shows you can't trust the opinions of people who are merely watching the game because it's impossible to tell just by watching.

I think the quickest Ive ever seen was also Shaoib in the 99 WC. Given that Thommo was quicker than Holding and Shaoib was bowling lightening, I dont think the comments sound too self-depreciating.

 

[Days of Grace]

Oooh sorry.

It's pretty relevant though that a bloke like Taylor took two blokes whose pace was supposedly so great for 334, whereas as blokes like Richards, Lloyd and others used words like "scary" and "dangerous" and "being in a war" in relation to facing Thomson.

Well, remember that in the 1970s blokes hardly wore helmets, so it was so brave stuff (some say crazy) to face up to fast bowlers back then.

I think that is why people tend to exaggerate the speeds of bowlers like Lahwood, Tyson, Thomson, et al, because they bowled to people without helmets or really anything like the protection that batsmen have nowadays. I am not saying they didn't bowl quick, but people maybe think it is quicker when the bloke facing is just wearing a floppy hat.

 

[Captain Cricket]

wearing a floppy hat.

Or nothing for that matter.

 

[Burgey]

Well, remember that in the 1970s blokes hardly wore helmets, so it was so brave stuff (some say crazy) to face up to fast bowlers back then.

I think that is why people tend to exaggerate the speeds of bowlers like Lahwood, Tyson, Thomson, et al, because they bowled to people without helmets or really anything like the protection that batsmen have nowadays. I am not saying they didn't bowl quick, but people maybe think it is quicker when the bloke facing is just wearing a floppy hat.

That's a fair point mate.

I wonder if they'll ever get the technology to be able to look at old film and measure speeds accurately from it? Might happen one day, but I'm technologically inept and couldn't tell you if it's possible or impossible.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

My sentiments exactly. No way he got anywhere near 180 or even 170 IMO. His fastest was probably 165 or thereabouts.

Obviously it's just speculation, but he was timed at close to 160 kph, with a measuring system that is naturally less friendly to the bowler in terms of clocking high speeds, and after an injury that others say reduced his pace. I don't think 170 is out of the question at all, not because Thomson claims it, so it's not a matter of whether or not you "believe" him, but because there's reasonable evidence to suggest it. 180 is out of the question IMO, that would mean he was about as fast compared to Brett Lee as Lee is compared to Symonds, but 170 or close to it I can imagine for an effort ball in friendly conditions.

You only have to look at that fast bowling competition and the huge margin he held over the other famous fast bowlers of his time like Holding, Lillee, Imran etc to see that he was one of a kind in terms of pace, at least early in his career.

 

[Jono]

Or nothing for that matter.

Yeah, the old 'hatless' look. A cardinal sin nowadays, but back then it was apprently accepted.

If anyone ever walked out to bat hatless nowadays I'd throw so much abuse at them it'd be untolerable. Seen Dhoni bat hatless temporarily whilst waiting for a change from helmet to hat, and this was when he had his locks flowing.

Was quite a sight.

 

[Days of Grace]

I wouldn't read too much into the competition. Holding himself was past his 'peak' in terms of true speed as well. I believe his peak to be in the 1976 test series against England.

 

[Top_Cat]

Obviously it's just speculation, but he was timed at close to 160 kph, with a measuring system that is naturally less friendly to the bowler in terms of clocking high speeds

Doubtful. What Thommo says about speed being measured at the batting end is rubbish. Similar, error with regards infra-red measurements is wildly overblown, despite what pundits say. Just because a bowler says he 'feels' like he bowled a quick ball doesn't mean he did. 170km/h is well and truly out of the bounds of physiological reality.