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The Importance of Being a World Cup Winner

OverratedSanity

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yeah, agreed. Dhoni has to be in any AT ODI XI and there is just no point in having gilly around then.
I really don't know why you can't have both. Dhoni's good enough to be selected as batsman alone. Gilly gets in as the far better keeper. Dhoni's selection hardly makes Gilchrist pointless.
 

smalishah84

The Tiger King
I really don't know why you can't have both. Dhoni's good enough to be selected as batsman alone. Gilly gets in as the far better keeper. Dhoni's selection hardly makes Gilchrist pointless.
Sure Gilchrist is a better keeper but then in ODIs Dhoni is pretty decent. It's not like there is daylight between the 2 in terms of ODI keeping. Secondly in place of Gilchrist you can have somebody like Jayasuriya or Mark Waugh who can give you genuine ODI bowling options as well
 

OverratedSanity

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Sure Gilchrist is a better keeper but then in ODIs Dhoni is pretty decent. It's not like there is daylight between the 2 in terms of ODI keeping. Secondly in place of Gilchrist you can have somebody like Jayasuriya or Mark Waugh who can give you genuine ODI bowling options as well
Of course you can. But saying selecting Dhoni means there's no point in selecting Gilly is wrong.
 

SuperMurali

School Boy/Girl Captain
when selecting my greatest team from players that I've seen play live, I've included both of them, but that's because I never got to see God play so that left an opening spot available for Gilly
 

G.I.Joe

International Coach
Picking both Dhoni and Gilchrist deprives the second team of a gun keeper-batsman, so there's that.
 

hendrix

Hall of Fame Member
when selecting my greatest team from players that I've seen play live, I've included both of them, but that's because I never got to see God play so that left an opening spot available for Gilly

I'm sure there'll be plenty more opportunities to see Kane Williamson play over the next decade or so. He's only 24.
 

SuperMurali

School Boy/Girl Captain
I'm sure there'll be plenty more opportunities to see Kane Williamson play over the next decade or so. He's only 24.
was making a Sachin joke, but yeah, Williamson will be one of NZ's best. seen him play a couple of times. saw him score a century Waitangi Day last year against India

183a.jpg
 

smalishah84

The Tiger King
Why not have both? Best finisher and 2nd best opener of all time.
Because I can do better with other openers. For e.g. Jayauriya and Mark Waugh offer significantly more. So to pair up with Tendulkar I'll get either of them than Gilly.
 

smalishah84

The Tiger King
yep, slightly lower average and SR but that too because he played a third of his career in a slower scoring time. Arguably will be a better fielder as well in any position other than wk of course. Also a genuine 5th bowler in an ATXI.
 
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Jono

Virat Kohli (c)
Curious, given Jayasuriya's lower average and strike rate.
I'd have Gilly, but you better not be the same guy who criticises people for being Excel spreadsheet nerds :p You can argue Sanath changed the game and that can be taken into account when choosing an ATG XI instead of pure stats.

Also where does Amla sit in this argument? If he has a good World Cup this year its open slather for him to make an ATG XI
 

Kirkut

International Debutant
No xuhaib I am not saying he played on for more glory. I am asking us how do we remember the players of the past and how much of an impact a WC win adds to their legacy

The following players have mighty reputations despite no WC winner's medals

Lara
Kallis
Dravid
Hadlee
Ambrose
Lillee

A million Sreesanths and Kaluwitharanas can't match even one of them, I know.

The question I am asking is:

If in the 1992 final, had England won the game with Botham scoring a 40 ball 70 with 8 fours and 3 sixes. And gotten the wickets of Miandad, Imran and Inzamam for 10-2-27-3. And taken two catches on top of that....

It would still be just a one match performance. Imran and Ian Botham combined have played in 500+ matches for their countries. Taken 1000+ wickets. Scored more than fifty 50+ scores. They are capable of such a performance on any given day... But, would that one performance in a WC final have changed their historical standing? Would we have called Beefy the best of the four allrounders if this had happened? How much of my Imran love (or everyone's) is hinging on that WC win?

A different way of asking the question is this: If SL wins this WC will we be calling Sangakara the greatest modern bat? Considering he is already in the discussion and justifiably so, will such an event make him a clear winner?
That is exactly how some Tendulkar critics complain that he is not a match winner like Lara. That mistimed hook shot off Mcgrath in 2003 final made a huge impact and media capitalised on it. In the same world cup he played a great knock against Pakistan, taking on Akhtar at his fastest.
 
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Top_Cat

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Nah, that accusation against Sachin has been around a long, long time. 2003 was just the culmination of it.
 

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