Road to Euro 2024

[Chubb]

San Marino scored a goal and only lost 2-1 to Denmark.

 

[Uppercut]

Yeah I like the Kaka comparison best. He was a bit washed at Real Madrid but at AC Milan he covered so much ground. It was kinda what stood out about him, he was just as good technically as Rui Costa had been at 10 except he was also running defences ragged. He didn't scrap like Bellingham does but I think he would if he played today.

 

[Uppercut]

Thinking about Kaka always also reminds me of just how incredible Ronaldinho was as well tbh, and how he's probably actually underrated/unfairly forgotten about these days. Very different players in many ways, but similar in the way both were capable of driving a team forward by getting hold of the ball and driving through defences. I rate Kaka very highly, and would say he was easily one of the best players in the world for much of his career, certainly in his position. But I always think that if I had to choose between him and Ronaldinho, it's not even close. Ronaldinho was one of the most remarkable players I think I have ever seen. Kaka's being great but still clearly several tiers below him in terms of ability just emphasises this. Mad really.

I don't think Ronaldinho is underrated or forgotten. His endless highlight reel of insane skill and unique wondergoals makes it very easy to convince kids how good he was. I risk falling down a YouTube rabbit hole every time he's brought up.

 

[sledger]

It still amazes me that I saw them both play against Portsmouth at Fratton Park. Portsmouth 2-0 up with 15 mins to play, then Ronaldinho takes over. Scores one free kick then sets up Inzaghi for the equaliser. And to be honest, I think I'd prefer that outcome to seeing a 2-0 win.

Haha I had completely forgotten about Portsmouth playing in Europe. Seems a completely ridiculous possibility now.

 

[sledger]

I don't think Ronaldinho is underrated or forgotten. His endless highlight reel of insane skill and unique wondergoals makes it very easy to convince kids how good he was.

He just doesn't seem to get mentioned that much these days, or so it seems to me anyway. Perhaps it's because he didn't have the same longevity as some of his peers, but whenever people get asked about the best players of the last few decades people tend to understandably mention Ronaldo, Messi, Zidane, the other Ronaldo, Henry etc., but he doesn't seem to get mentioned nearly as often. Or he is brought up in a way that suggests he was a tier below the others, which is categorically wrong for me. But yeah that could just be my perception tbh.

 

[Molehill]

Haha I had completely forgotten about Portsmouth playing in Europe. Seems a completely ridiculous possibility now.

Probably less ridiculous than to Brighton fans when they were playing league games on the middle of an Athletics track with barely a stand to watch in.

 

[sledger]

Just watched his goal against Chelsea back several times. One of those ones you can watch over and over again and no matter how many times you see it you'll still be amazed by it. Bloke has the ball pretty much under his feet outside the box, 5-6 Chelsea defenders around him/between him and the goal, doesn't even take a step, just lifts his right foot and pokes it into the corner. Can't think of another goal like it.

 

[Uppercut]

He just doesn't seem to get mentioned that much these days, or so it seems to me anyway. Perhaps it's because he didn't have the same longevity as some of his peers, but whenever people get asked about the best players of the last few decades people tend to understandably mention Ronaldo, Messi, Zidane, the other Ronaldo, Henry etc., but he doesn't seem to get mentioned nearly as often. Or he is brought up in a way that suggests he was a tier below the others, which is categorically wrong for me. But yeah that could just be my perception tbh.

Yeah this might be true. But when he does come up I never see anyone who disputes that he was incredible.

I’m not someone who hates comparisons generally, but Ronaldinho was so unique that comparisons miss the point. Like with Shane Warne, how he compares with other great players is just not at all what’s interesting about him. Maybe that’s why he doesn’t come up in those conversations.

 

[Furball]

I feel like Bellingham is the sort of player you imagine Duncan Edwards to have been when you read accounts of players who played alongside him.

Also going to throw it out there that Zidane is probably the most over-rated modern footballer there is; good international tournaments in 2000 and 2006, along with a spectacular goal at Hampden in the 2002 Champions League final do a lot of heavy lifting for a fairly average club career.

 

[sledger]

Yeah this might be true. But when he does come up I never see anyone who disputes that he was incredible.

I’m not someone who hates comparisons generally, but Ronaldinho was so unique that comparisons miss the point. Like with Shane Warne, how he compares with other great players is just not at all what’s interesting about him. Maybe that’s why he doesn’t come up in those conversations.

Yeah true. If any player is deserving of being called un-comparable it's him.

 

[sledger]

Also going to throw it out there that Zidane is probably the most over-rated modern footballer there is; good international tournaments in 2000 and 2006, along with a spectacular goal at Hampden in the 2002 Champions League final do a lot of heavy lifting for a fairly average club career.

So, I guess what you are saying is that you don't "get him"?

 

[Chin Music]

I feel like Bellingham is the sort of player you imagine Duncan Edwards to have been when you read accounts of players who played alongside him.

Also going to throw it out there that Zidane is probably the most over-rated modern footballer there is; good international tournaments in 2000 and 2006, along with a spectacular goal at Hampden in the 2002 Champions League final do a lot of heavy lifting for a fairly average club career.

No mention of the 1998 World Cup final goals? I guess there are some players who perhaps shine better for their country than clubs, but he has a pretty impressive international repertoire for me. He probably went to Juventus at the wrong time as Italian football lost the money and then Real Madrid went in for the Galactico nonsense after 2002 and stopped being an elite European team for quite a few years after. I remember an awful defender called Pavon who was an utter carthorse, but he nigh on hand to play there because they'd wasted money on all the midfielders and forwards.

 

[sledger]

The thing is though, Zidane is the kind of player who you can forget the record of entirely, and just watch him play for 5 minutes, and his greatness is immediately obvious.

 

[Furball]

No mention of the 1998 World Cup final goals?

This is the perfect example of what I mean; Zidane was a non-factor in 1998 until he got his head on a couple of corner kicks.

Your comment about Juventus is also wrong as the Italian league was still very much the place to be until the early 2000s.

 

[Furball]

So, I guess what you are saying is that you don't "get him"?

No, that's not what I'm saying. Zidane was a marvellous player, but wasn't on the same level as the great players of the following generation.

 

[Pothas]

Zidane is very much a pre-stats player, sort of the last of those mythical footballers. I wonder how he would be rated today.

If there is a somewhat forgotten brilliant player from Brazil I reckon it is Rivaldo.

 

[Pothas]

Obviously all these players really suffer from Messi and Ronaldo following them.

 

[Uppercut]

Zidane was amazing, but it is possible for players to look better than they are. If you’re playing Real Madrid in the early 2000s and given the choice between OG Ronaldo being out injured and Zidane being out injured, I don’t really think it’s close.

 

[sledger]

No, that's not what I'm saying.

haha woosh

 

[Chin Music]

This is the perfect example of what I mean; Zidane was a non-factor in 1998 until he got his head on a couple of corner kicks.

Your comment about Juventus is also wrong as the Italian league was still very much the place to be until the early 2000s.

I still thought he looked pretty good to me, although of course he did get sent off foolishly.

For me, it was the latter mid 90s that Serie A started to go a little downhill with the Spanish League starting to overtake it. I used to watch it quite a lot when it was on C4 in the early to mid 90s.