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Richards v Tendulkar - ODIs

Who is the best ODI batsman of all time?


  • Total voters
    91

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
This coming from someone who worships Warne and Ponting. Where is the irony meter when you need one.

Either ways, your point is proven wrong here because many of us have picked Richards over Tendulkar when we could have all picked Tendulkar easily.
Yes, with Warne I am heavily biased, it's something I wear as a badge.

With Ponting, no. I think Richards is better than him. I just think Ponting is the best in his era. Actually, in terms of "like" I like Dravid and Sehwag more.

Many of you Indians have picked Tendulkar over Richards...congrats. Most of the neutrals didn't. If that hurts, it hurts I guess.
 

Zinzan

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zinzan will have a point when he himself is not biased . From what one has seen he is one of the most biased member here.
.
Woohoooo, way to lose an argument Sanza ! When the facts get too much, why not just put all rational argument aside, run in the other direction with your bra-strap flapping in the wind & resort to a nice irrational sweeping personal allegation that I'm just 'bias' :clapping: ( that clap is from the feminist debate group BTW) . A truly sensational cop-out that, must remember to use it myself next time I'm struggling to think of a comeback - true genius

Can I just clarify one thing though, presumably I'm more bias against Sachin specifically when it comes to ODI's, but more bias against Richards when it comes to Test cricket, since I voted Sachin > Richards in tests right? Then again, I voted Bradman over Sachin as a test batsman, so I suppose that suggests I'm still moderately bias against Sachin in Tests overall :( That said, Muhammad Ali is my favourite all-time sportsman, ahead of Bradman, so I suppose that does expose a slight bias against Bradman & Australian's in general too :boxed:
 
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Sir Alex

Banned
Yes, with Warne I am heavily biased, it's something I wear as a badge.

With Ponting, no. I think Richards is better than him. I just think Ponting is the best in his era. Actually, in terms of "like" I like Dravid and Sehwag more.

Many of you Indians have picked Tendulkar over Richards...congrats. Most of the neutrals didn't. If that hurts, it hurts I guess.
Ha yet you have no conclusive case for Richards being greater than Tendulkar.So I gather Tendulkar is greater than Ponting.Anyway Ponting era is a subera in Tendulkar era so I don't think it is a huge mistake to not consider Tendulkar while you said Ponting being the best in his era :p

Ok I was just having some fun. :p
 

Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
From my post that started the thread:




Now who is being dishonest? Seriously, you're not all there. The whole point of that thread was to say that Donald was every bit as good as McGrath and that I thought people overrated McGrath and created myths for him when their records were strikingly similar.
Still You, The thread was never called "Donald Over Mcgrath" as you tried to claim here.

And if the point of your thread was " Donald was every bit as good as McGrath" then it means you are wrong in claiming that you started "Donald Over Mcgrath" . Donald over Mcgrath means you think Donald better than Mcgrath not as good as him. Neither your opening nor your closing in that thread suggests that.

So yes, you are the one who is being intellectually dishonest.
 

Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
Woohoooo, way to lose an argument Sanza ! When the facts get too much, why not just put all rational argument aside, run in the other direction with your bra-strap flapping in the wind & resort to a nice irrational sweeping personal allegation that I'm just 'bias' :clapping: ( that clap is from the feminist debate group BTW) . A truly sensational cop-out that, must remember to use it myself next time I'm struggling to think of a comeback - true genius

Can I just clarify one thing though, presumably I'm more bias against Sachin specifically when it comes to ODI's, but more bias against Richards when it comes to Test cricket, since I voted Sachin > Richards in tests right? Then again, I voted Bradman over Sachin as a test batsman, so I suppose that suggests I'm still moderately bias against Sachin in Tests overall :( That said, Muhammad Ali is my favourite all-time sportsman, ahead of Bradman, so I suppose that does expose a slight bias against Bradman & Australian's in general too :boxed:
zinzan12, it doesn't matter how you voted on Tendulkar Vs. Richard. The point is you are not above your nationalistic bias and yet you accuse of Indian members of voting in favor of Tendulkar because of nationalist/patriotic bias as if Tendulkar doesn't deserve to be there in this discussion.

I personally tend to think that majority of the Indian members are a. Either too young to appreciate how good Richards was b. or maybe just dumbstruck after that knock of 200.

As for case b Voting under influence does/should not be counted as being biased.
 
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Zinzan

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I personally tend to think that majority of the Indian members are a. Either too young to appreciate how good Richards was b. or maybe just dumbstruck after that knock of 200.

As for case b Voting under influence does/should not be counted as being biased.
Lol...let me understand this.... since I quite correctly pointed out a very obvious variance between the way Indian fans (in general) voted on this poll - which was more than 2 to 1 in favour of Sachin & the way neutrals voted - which was 2 to 1 in favour of Richards, which is of significant difference BTW, the only conclusion you can reach from this is that I'm biased?

This is despite the fact I've pointed out on multiple occasions that if the situation was mirrored in an Ponting vs. Lara poll, I'd be making the same point & despite my acknowledgment the most fans (from all countries) have a "natural bias", hence I said it's not exclusively an Indian thing. If we are talking about a slight "natural bias", then, I'm no different to most in that respect, but maybe in a sub-conscious/unintentional way. but after all that is my point.:ph34r:

Let me ask you another question .....Suppose you're watching a gymnastics event , a Russian & an American are competing head to head. There are 10 judges, 4 of which are from America, 6 from neutral countries and no judges at all from Russian. Suppose you then discover the neutral vote was 2:1 in favour of the Russian, but the 4 American judges voted more than 2 to 1 in favour of the American, meaning the overall result was about even. Am assuming that you would consider it an outrage if someone (correctly) pointed out that the American judges votes could well be distorting the true picture here , & you'd suggest anyone that made such an observation are just 'bias'
 

Zinzan

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No, everyone is biased, that's not the point. The point is as Indians pretty much worship Tendulkar very few are going to vote against him if he is in the statistical ball-park. Richards on the other hand doesn't have many of his countrymen here and most of the people that voted for him are neutrals. Naturally, if there were more West Indies fans here they'd vote for their hero too. Although since they have so many awesome cricketers they're not necessarily stuck on worshipping one.
To be fair, pretty sure most Indian fan's on the forum do actually get this. I know this, because if it were such an unreasonable observation, I'd be jumped on from every direction, that I can assure you. The reality is that it's only Sanz & a couple of others that can't grasp what is a patently obvious pattern. :)
 

Uppercut

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Firstly those who voted for Richards thus far;

Anil - India
Athlai - NZ
Edged&Taken -
Fusion -Pakistan
grecian - England
Himannv - Sri Lanka
Ikki - Aust
jaideep -
jondavluc - Aust
kingcool1432 -
L Trumper - Aust
marc71178 - England
Maximus0723 - India
morgieb - Aust
Noble One - Aust
Pratters - India
Sanz - India
Shaggy Alfresco- England
sledger - England
Streetwise - Aust i
Swervy -
The_Bunny - Aust
Uppercut - Ireland
zaremba - Eng
zinzan12 - NZ



Secondly those who voted for Tendulkar

AaronK - Pakistan
asty80 -
bagapath- India
Cevno - India
cheeky_vinu -
Cruxdude - India
Dasa - India
DingDong - NZ
duffer - India
Faisal1985, - Pakistan
freaknasty - India
G.I.Joe - India
havocas - India
honestbharani - India
JBH001 -
Manee - India
metallics2006 - India
Migara - SL
pasag - Aust
punter2002 -
silentstriker - India
Sir Alex - India
SJS - India
stephen- Australia
Turbinator India

Thought I'd help it for you.
More precisely, using these nationalities (edited a few, blanks not counted, correct me if I'm wrong on anyone), 15 out of 19 Indians voted for Sachin. 79% Tendulkar, 21% Richards.

7/22 non-Indians voted for Tendulkar. 32% Tendulkar, 68% Richards.

So Indians generally rate Sachin Tendulkar higher than anyone else does. In other news, the pope is a Catholic and bears sometimes crap in the woods.
 

Anil

Hall of Fame Member
victory? victory, you say? master zinzan, not victory. The shroud of the dark side has fallen. begun, the stat war has!
 

Zinzan

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More precisely, using these nationalities (edited a few, blanks not counted, correct me if I'm wrong on anyone), 15 out of 19 Indians voted for Sachin. 79% Tendulkar, 21% Richards.

7/22 non-Indians voted for Tendulkar. 32% Tendulkar, 68% Richards.

So Indians generally rate Sachin Tendulkar higher than anyone else does. In other news, the pope is a Catholic and bears sometimes crap in the woods.
A totally outrageous & unreasonable suggestion, how can you say something like that!

So you're implying ALL Indian fans are completely & intentionally bias right ?




Edit: excuse me sarcasm, nice to someone else spotting the patently obvious pattern :cool:
 

Zinzan

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victory? victory, you say? master zinzan, not victory. The shroud of the dark side has fallen. begun, the stat war has!
Meh, true victory would be beating my girlfriend's old-man at Tennis this arvo truth be told
 

Uppercut

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^ Most would also realize that my pointing out the very obvious pattern doesn't automatically mean I'm implying that ALL Indian voters are being intentionally & consciously bias, no more so than other fans are.
Bias can be quite a comical human trait in that it leads people to see it in everyone else. The militant fan doesn't notice the opinions you state which they agree with- they're considered super-standard- and hence it looks like you're bagging their team every time you say something.
 

Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
Lol...let me understand this.... since I quite correctly pointed out a very obvious variance between the way Indian fans (in general) voted on this poll - which was more than 2 to 1 in favour of Sachin & the way neutrals voted - which was 2 to 1 in favour of Richards, which is of significant difference BTW, the only conclusion you can reach from this is that I'm biased?

This is despite the fact I've pointed out on multiple occasions that if the situation was mirrored in an Ponting vs. Lara poll, I'd be making the same point & despite my acknowledgment the most fans (from all countries) have a "natural bias", hence I said it's not exclusively an Indian thing. If we are talking about a slight "natural bias", then, I'm no different to most in that respect, but maybe in a sub-conscious/unintentional way. but after all that is my point.:ph34r:
Zinzan12, Most (if not all) of the Indian members who voted for Tendulkar have more credibility than you have on anything and that's not even including your views on Martin Crowe. The fact that Richards despite having retired 20 years ago still commands that kind of respect speaks of volumes of his standing on this forum. I do not believe many other players from his generation would even stand that chance aqgainst the likes of Tendulkar, Ponting etc.


Talking about Neutrals, folks like Ikki, Streetwise,zaremba, yourself are not really neutral. You are also biased in your voting. Infact I am biased as well, having watched IVAR play, I don't think I will ever vote for Tendulkar (against him) no matter how good he is and I am sure there are many who feel same way.


Let me ask you another question .....Suppose you're watching a gymnastics event , a Russian & an American are competing head to head. There are 10 judges, 4 of which are from America, 6 from neutral countries and no judges at all from Russian. Suppose you then discover the neutral vote was 2:1 in favour of the Russian, but the 4 American judges voted more than 2 to 1 in favour of the American, meaning the overall result was about even. Am assuming that you would consider it an outrage if someone (correctly) pointed out that the American judges votes could well be distorting the true picture here , & you'd suggest anyone that made such an observation are just 'bias'
Wrong analogy. America and Russia have a history of disliking each other, one is communist the other is captalist. There is mutual distrust between the two.

No Such thing in India/WI. IVAR is loved universally including India so is Tendulkar including WI.
 

Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
To be fair, pretty sure most Indian fan's on the forum do actually get this. I know this, because if it were such an unreasonable observation, I'd be jumped on from every direction, that I can assure you. The reality is that it's only Sanz & a couple of others that can't grasp what is a patently obvious pattern. :)
And that pattern is common to Indians only ? Won't you fit the pattern if a poll involved an NZ Player and a non-NZ player ?

Here is a poll on Lillee Vs. Hadlee, Please let us know the pattern.

http://www.cricketweb.net/forum/cricket-chat/poll-1548-a.html
 
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Migara

Cricketer Of The Year


Compounded with the fact that McGrath took his wicket 6 times in 9 matches...and McGrath had injury problems of his own. Yeh, I'd say he was poor at worst and mediocre at best against McGrath, overall. Successes, failures, and overall not an impressive record. Sounds like most other batsmen against McGrath.

But anyways, that's Tests. Let's not derail the thread here.
Now tell me the bowler whom Richards played as equal to McGrath in ODIs.
 

Migara

Cricketer Of The Year
Hadlee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Yes, my bad. I may add Imran as well. McGrath for me is the ultimate ODI bowler, and I believe him to be the best ODI bowler ever followed by Wasim and Murali. for me McGrath > Imran & Hadlee, Wasim > Imran & Hadlee and Murali > Imran and Hadlee in ODIs
 

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