**Official** English Football Season 2023/24

[Furball]

20 titles total isn't it?

Ferguson has 13 off the top of my head, and Busby's Wiki page reckons he won 5.

 

[Uppercut]

Poch was the one who wanted lo Celso instead of Bruno and also wanted Ndombele didnt he? maybe he would have been the right guy to stick with at that time but their form was dire, the players looked exhausted and like you said it felt untenable. its not even the 1st eg of an intense manager who took a club to the next level eventually burning out as I pointed with Klopp so im not sure why this is such a controversial opinion

I actually think Ndombele and Lo Celso were decent signings that just didn’t work out. It’s not like with Fred where you watch two games and wonder what they were thinking. Ndombele especially was ridiculously talented.

Dortmund shouldn’t have fired Klopp either. I can’t remember if it was quite a firing, but they should have tried hard to keep him. They weren’t even awful that season, just went on a bad run of finishing luck. Spurs were at least actually playing terribly when they fired Poch.

 

[Magrat Garlick]

20 titles total isn't it?

Ferguson has 13 off the top of my head, and Busby's Wiki page reckons he won 5.

the other two were some guy before WWI

 

[Socerer 01]

I actually think Ndombele and Lo Celso were decent signings that just didn’t work out. It’s not like with Fred where you watch two games and wonder what they were thinking. Ndombele especially was ridiculously talented.

Dortmund shouldn’t have fired Klopp either. I can’t remember if it was quite a firing, but they should have tried hard to keep him. They weren’t even awful that season, just went on a bad run of finishing luck. Spurs were at least actually playing terribly when they fired Poch.

Ndombele is such a weird case, looked so good at Lyon and then gave up for Spurs instantly

in fairness i think Klopp wanted to leave more than Dortmund sacking him from what I remember

 

[peterhrt]

Good question. Nearest would be between 1963-1967 where they alternated the 4 Div 1 League Winners between them. Only in the first did they finish 1st and 2nd though, a feat they also did in 87-88.

Also in 1947, 1980 and 2009.

 

[Tangles]

I don’t think the current social media/media environments help clubs at all. Not for football. The constant United in crisis stories for the last 10 years generate clicks and keep them in the headlines so help the marketing profile.

The tabloids were always doing this in a way but it just seems way worse than it’s ever been and it’s not a help to players or managers. Just a bigger distraction.

United under the Glazers have revenue so tied to top 4 that they can’t bring in a manager and reset the squad. They just won’t ever plan for anything less than top 4 even if that might be better long term because there is no long term. There is no next season.

 

[Tangles]

Question on the Liverpool example. Where they ever hated like United seem to be now? I don’t really remember before 85 when I was in school and started following.

The Liverpool parallels are there. Current United is not likely to have a squad good enough or deep enough to win the league. Cup runs more likely.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Liverpool were hated yes, possibly more so after Heysel as all English teams were banned. Teams like Luton haven't forgiven them for denying them their one chance of European football.

 

[Furball]

I love Thursdays

 

[grecian]

Liverpool; were hated, but it's real;l;y hard to say how much, simply;y because football; wasn't anything like the global juggernaut it is now, in fact it was hugely untrendy, because of hooligans and the like and arguably the FA Cup was more prestigious than the League amongst many.

United were hated by so many more since football was clearly much more popular after Italia 90 and the Prem starting.

 

[Skipper Pup]

Poch was the one who wanted lo Celso instead of Bruno and also wanted Ndombele didnt he? maybe he would have been the right guy to stick with at that time but their form was dire, the players looked exhausted and like you said it felt untenable. its not even the 1st eg of an intense manager who took a club to the next level eventually burning out as I pointed with Klopp so im not sure why this is such a controversial opinion

I'm shocked you didn't mention Davinson Sanchez, what a signing that was.

People talk about how little funds he got to rebuild what was an ageing squad but in reality he had the money available he just had no idea how to use it properly. Bergwijn, Sessegnon, Ndombele, Lucas Moura, Aurier, Llorente, Janssen, N'Koudou.. the list goes on. They even spent £10mil on some young talent who's running around for Sunderland now.

With where Spurs were at the time, it was absolutely the right decision to let him go. They obviously didn't go about replacing him the right way but it was evident that things were on a downward trajectory and he was a large part to blame for that.

 

[duffer]

Liverpool; were hated, but it's real;l;y hard to say how much, simply;y because football; wasn't anything like the global juggernaut it is now, in fact it was hugely untrendy, because of hooligans and the like and arguably the FA Cup was more prestigious than the League amongst many.

United were hated by so many more since football was clearly much more popular after Italia 90 and the Prem starting.

????

 

[grecian]

????

Oh I still despise them, but I feel as long as their mediocrity continues it gets lesser, As I've said many times I disliked United before Ferguson, because I hated their struggling narrative when they won cups and the like.

I will always despise them, the likes of Ferguson and Keanes despicable exploitation of the rules to badger officials is why we now have all managers and players doing this, **** them and all who sail in them.

 

[dontcloseyoureyes]

Liverpool; were hated, but it's real;l;y hard to say how much, simply;y because football; wasn't anything like the global juggernaut it is now, in fact it was hugely untrendy, because of hooligans and the like and arguably the FA Cup was more prestigious than the League amongst many.

United were hated by so many more since football was clearly much more popular after Italia 90 and the Prem starting.

You also couldn't read the unfiltered thoughts of every ****ing imbecile on the planet at the click of your fingers.

 

[sledger]

I think it's presumptuous to suggest Utd are hated anything like as much as they were in the 90s tbh. There is sure to be some lingering legacy hatred, if you will, but real hate requires relevancy.

 

[Molehill]

Question on the Liverpool example. Where they ever hated like United seem to be now? I don’t really remember before 85 when I was in school and started following.

I grew up on the South Coast in the 70's/80's. Kids either supported their local clubs or Liverpool. If you supported your local club then you hated Liverpool because of all the plastic fans. Then of course there was Heysel, Liverpool got the blame for all Clubs being thrown out of Europe when really they were just the straw that broke the camel's back.

I would much rather see Man Utd win trophies than Liverpool - ironic given that many of my friends now are actual Scousers.

 

[GIMH]

People hated Man U before they were good, as Grecian said. Liverpool have some very weird ‘online’ fans these days that probably make them more disliked around the world. I don’t actually mind the ‘insular’ attitude of their match going fans etc as I tend to think that’s been a contributor to their success over the years.

 

[Molehill]

People hated Man U before they were good, as Grecian said. Liverpool have some very weird ‘online’ fans these days that probably make them more disliked around the world. I don’t actually mind the ‘insular’ attitude of their match going fans etc as I tend to think that’s been a contributor to their success over the years.

That's true, the online fans are never actual Scousers though. It's a good point about the 'insular' nature of the match going fans, that they have zero interest in the England team for example probably doesn't help.

 

[peterhrt]

A major strength of the old English Football League used to be uncertainty. During 18 seasons between 1959 and 1976, eleven different clubs won the league, with none retaining the title from one year to the next.

Then Liverpool spoiled the party. Ten league championships in fifteen seasons. Folk grew tired of them and interest in the league declined.

The Premier League accelerated the concentration of money and power into few hands. Two thirds of titles have been hoovered up by the Manchester clubs, with Londoners Chelsea and Arsenal claiming all but three of the rest.

This season so far has seen a welcome return to old times in that several fixtures on a given day affect the top of the table.

 

[Uppercut]

The best teams used to always be a bit nasty, because the game rewarded a bit of nastiness. It made them very easy to hate. It’s not really like that now. City must be the most indifference-inspiring elite sports team of all time.