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Brendon McCullum

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Large numbers? No, but still Australia have some 4 or 5 good bowlers who can step up to test cricket on an emergency while England has zilch. The continued selection of Broad in test cricket despite his poor record prior to WI series' is testimony to this.
No-one's saying England have better reserves than Australia. Simply that Australian domestic teams do not have large numbers - or even 4 or 5 - bowlers who would be good Test bowlers if pitched into Test cricket.

Australia are struggling to find 4 Test-standard bowlers. The notion that they undoubtedly have more than 3 is laughable.
 

Uppercut

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None of what I said there is untrue. Some people seem to think Nannes is a youngster because he's never been heard of until the last year, but I assure you, he's not. He was born in May 1976, making him 33 as of this post, and had played 3 First-Class matches up to his 31st birthday.
I'm entirely aware of his age, thanks. I was just wondering why you think he's not as good a bowler as Stuart Broad when he's so obviously much better.
 

wfdu_ben91

International 12th Man
Richard said:
None of what I said there is untrue. Some people seem to think Nannes is a youngster because he's never been heard of until the last year, but I assure you, he's not. He was born in May 1976, making him 33 as of this post, and had played 3 First-Class matches up to his 31st birthday.
For most of Dirk Nannes' adult life, cricket has been an afterthought. He used to play a couple of club games at the start of the season, a handful at the end, and in between travel the world pursuing his other passion, skiing. He was no run-of-the-mill ski bum - he competed for several years in World Cup skiing events and narrowly missed selection for the Australian Winter Olympics team in the late 1990s. But when he started to take his cricket seriously, he quickly grabbed the attention of Victoria's selectors. It led to a first-class debut at 29 in 2005-06.

Dirk Nannes | Cricket Players and Officials | Cricinfo.com
 

wfdu_ben91

International 12th Man
No-one's saying England have better reserves than Australia. Simply that Australian domestic teams do not have large numbers - or even 4 or 5 - bowlers who would be good Test bowlers if pitched into Test cricket.

Australia are struggling to find 4 Test-standard bowlers. The notion that they undoubtedly have more than 3 is laughable.
This post is laughable.

Darren Pattinson was good enough to play Test Cricket for England but yet wasn't good enough to play in the Sheffield Shield Final for Victoria. Dirk Nannes, Damien Wright, Shane Harwood and Clint McKay were all selected ahead of him. Peter Siddle & Andrew McDonald would've been selected aswell if they weren't busy on International duties, so that makes 6 bowlers better then Pattinson, who easily burst into the England team, in just a matter of first-class matches. Wasn't even as if he performed badly either, took 2 wickets and outbowled your regulars. Pattinson's just an average grade cricketer aswell, many throughout Australia could do a similar job.
 

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This post is laughable.

Darren Pattinson was good enough to play Test Cricket for England but yet wasn't good enough to play in the Sheffield Shield Final for Victoria. Dirk Nannes, Damien Wright, Shane Harwood and Clint McKay were all selected ahead of him. Peter Siddle & Andrew McDonald would've been selected aswell if they weren't busy on International duties, so that makes 6 bowlers better then Pattinson, who easily burst into the England team, in just a matter of first-class matches. Wasn't even as if he performed badly either, took 2 wickets and outbowled your regulars. Pattinson's just an average grade cricketer aswell, many throughout Australia could do a similar job.
Pffft. Hardly a credible argument to use the worst selectorial decision in recent memory as an example of England's general standard of bowling.
 

jondavluc

State Regular
I don't know if I would call Darren "the worst selection in recent memory" He wasn't a bad selection just so left field .He certainly is better than most of the choices they had at the time .I would certainly pick him over broad who wasn't that flash at the time (I haven't seen much of him lately so can't really judge him now).
 
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wfdu_ben91

International 12th Man
Pffft. Hardly a credible argument to use the worst selectorial decision in recent memory as an example of England's general standard of bowling.
Well to be fair, he did dominate county cricket, to warrant a selection. Funny how no other Englishmen could do the same at that point in time, eh?

Here's a list of bowlers from Australia currently, who could potentially play International cricket in another country.

Mitchell Johnson
Brett Lee
Stuart Clark
Peter Siddle
Doug Bollinger
Dirk Nannes
Shane Harwood
Nathan Bracken
Ben Hilfenhaus
Shaun Tait
Mark Cameron
Aaron Bird
Burt ****ley
Clint McKay
Damien Wright
James Hopes
Ashley Noffke
Chris Swan
Allan Wise
Paul Rofe
Luke Butterworth
Brett Geeves
Gerard Denton
Brett Dorey
Aaron Heal
 

Uppercut

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Well to be fair, he did dominate county cricket, to warrant a selection. Funny how no other Englishmen could do the same at that point in time, eh?
He didn't dominate county cricket, that was what was so left-field about it. Pattinson was well down the rankings- see for yourself. And that's only in Division One.
 

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I don't know if I would call Darren "the worst selection in recent memory" He wasn't a bad selection just so left field .He certainly is better than most of the choices they had at the time .I would certainly pick him over broad who wasn't that flash at the time (I haven't seen much of him lately so can't really judge him now).
I think it was Goughy here who said that while Pattinson is far from the worst player to play for England in recent times, he was surely the worst selection. It reeked of the lack of a long-term plan, it was an insult to county cricketers who had been turning in performances for years only to have an England place given to a 29-year-old Australian who'd only played a few FC games- and not even done THAT well. He was then promptly discarded after one game and completely forgotten about, as if to say "we ballsed up". Shoddy treatment of Pattinson himself, and the words of "bringing in a new player upset the dressing room" just suggested that the side had become a cosy little club. Amid all these problems, the other thing that's often forgotten is that Pattinson wasn't even the best man for the job- far from it.

The standard of the man himself was not what was so bad about his selection.
 

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Only one bowler took more wickets at a lower average?:unsure:
???

Pattinson's 47 wickets @ 24.65 were beaten in both number and average by Ryan McLaren (49@23), Steve Harmison (60@22) and Callum Thorp (50@19) so i don't know which figures you were looking at. There were better figures than Pattinson too for James Tomlinson (67@24.76), Glenn Chapple (42@20.5), Mark Davies (39@15) and Imran Tahir (44@16).

Looking outside the top division, Kabir Ali took 59 wickets @18 and Chris Woakes 42@20.
 

rivera213

U19 Vice-Captain
Well to be fair, he did dominate county cricket, to warrant a selection. Funny how no other Englishmen could do the same at that point in time, eh?

Here's a list of bowlers from Australia currently, who could potentially play International cricket in another country.

Mitchell Johnson
Brett Lee
Stuart Clark
Peter Siddle
Doug Bollinger
Dirk Nannes
Shane Harwood
Nathan Bracken
Ben Hilfenhaus
Shaun Tait
Mark Cameron
Aaron Bird
Burt ****ley
Clint McKay
Damien Wright
James Hopes
Ashley Noffke
Chris Swan
Allan Wise
Paul Rofe
Luke Butterworth
Brett Geeves
Gerard Denton
Brett Dorey
Aaron Heal
Most of those could only play for Bangladesh or the West Indies IMO.

I think only Mitch would get into every XI in the world from that list.
 

Top_Cat

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Pffft. Hardly a credible argument to use the worst selectorial decision in recent memory as an example of England's general standard of bowling.
Pfft, Aus are waaaaaaaay better at poor selections. Picking Cam White in India as a bowling all-rounder, for example. At least Pattinson was picked to do a job he actually does for his club.

Classy use of 'pfft', by the way. Like the cut of your jib.
 
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Top_Cat

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Well to be fair, he did dominate county cricket, to warrant a selection. Funny how no other Englishmen could do the same at that point in time, eh?

Here's a list of bowlers from Australia currently, who could potentially play International cricket in another country.

Mitchell Johnson
Brett Lee
Stuart Clark
Peter Siddle
Doug Bollinger
Dirk Nannes
Shane Harwood
Nathan Bracken
Ben Hilfenhaus
Shaun Tait
Mark Cameron
Aaron Bird
Burt ****ley
Clint McKay
Damien Wright
James Hopes
Ashley Noffke
Chris Swan
Allan Wise
Paul Rofe
Luke Butterworth
Brett Geeves
Gerard Denton
Brett Dorey
Aaron Heal
What the? The two bowlers you pick from SA weren't even regulars in FC cricket last year!
 
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tooextracool

International Coach
???

Pattinson's 47 wickets @ 24.65 were beaten in both number and average by Ryan McLaren (49@23), Steve Harmison (60@22) and Callum Thorp (50@19) so i don't know which figures you were looking at. There were better figures than Pattinson too for James Tomlinson (67@24.76), Glenn Chapple (42@20.5), Mark Davies (39@15) and Imran Tahir (44@16).

Looking outside the top division, Kabir Ali took 59 wickets @18 and Chris Woakes 42@20.
Err, and how many of those were realistic prospects for that test match at Leeds?
 

tooextracool

International Coach
Large numbers? No, but still Australia have some 4 or 5 good bowlers who can step up to test cricket on an emergency while England has zilch.
This surely has to be some sort of joke? Australia for the first time managed to string together a competent attack since the retirement of Mcgrath and Warne against SA this year, and that was only because Johnson managed to improve his bowling beyond bounds.

Maybe you have short term memory, but let me remind you of the tour to India last year.
 

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