*Official* Second Test at Lords

[Prince EWS]

Pietersen would get a higher grade if he was somebody else

Pretty much sums up 90% of the criticism of him, IMO.

 

[Richard]

Also looks like we haven't seen the last of Panesar this series.

 

[Matt79]

Find Flintoff's celebrations a bit contrived, and it jars because of how disappointed I was when they occurred. But tbf, guys like Lee are much worse, and in doing his pose, he's not being at all rude to his opponents, so can't really knock him for it.

 

[The Sean]

Find Flintoff's celebrations a bit contrived, and it jars because of how disappointed I was when they occurred. But tbf, guys like Lee are much worse, and in doing his pose, he's not being at all rude to his opponents, so can't really knock him for it.

Fair to say my bitterness toward them is driven at least in part by the bolded section.

You're absolutely right about Lee too, genuinely cringe-worthy.

 

[zaremba]

wub.

grecian, I must have had you confused with someone else. zaremba a possibility.

I can't speak for what goes on inside your mind.

But yes, I certainly did criticise St Ricky after the 1st Test, and am happy to repeat that his reaction to defeat in the 2nd Test was extremely gracious.

 

[honestbharani]

Flintoff giving the umpire a hug. FFS.

Nah, well done England. Bring on Edgbaston.

lol.. where were u when Steve Waugh hugged Billy Bowden?

 

[tooextracool]

Im probably pretty late, but just wanted to state that Flintoff's efforts on the final day were as good and as hostile a performance I have seen from any fast bowler ever. It wasn't just the fact that he bowled quick, he frequently varied his length and more importantly bowled many deliveries that were full in length. As a result of his 93 mph bullets and the lengths he bowled (particularly the fact that he was varying between bouncers that were directed right at the body and yorkers), Clarke and Johnson looked clueless for the large part against him because they werent sure whether they needed to duck or put their bats down to block the stumps. And given the amount of reaction time they had it was essentially impossible to bat without some form of pre-meditation. That is truly what fast bowling is about. Its not always about taking wickets through swing and seam, sometimes it is just as simple as changing your lengths and bowling as flat out fast as you can. That spell was the stuff of dreams.

 

[Ikki]

I personally like Freddie's celebration. To me he seems like a cool guy and very quick to commiserate and congratulate so his standing arms out is fine IMO. Minimalistic and no overreaction. Like saying, "Yeh, I know I am pretty good".

With regards to his 5fers; I think bowling only 30 to 31 overs a match has limited him. Most frontline bowlers bowl more than that.

 

[honestbharani]

Kudos first of all to Ponting for being so gracious after what must have been a very tough loss for him to take... I suppose it is kinda easier when you are outplayed and expect defeat than when you lose a close one but still, he showed great sense with his words there... I have always maintained that he seems to be one of the more honest blokes around in the cricket world... Was a problem for me that he seemed to genuinely believe all his team mates play by the spirit of the game, but apart from that, personally I do think he is a very honest cricketer and comes across as someone who will the honest thing and avoid cliques in post match stuff...


Congrats to England and all English supporters. A great win indeed and a very dominant performance but for that final session on day 4...


Also, huge props to most Aussie posters here who have shown great sportiveness in accepting this defeat inspite of what seems to be quite a few controversial decisions going against them.. Obviously, you guys are much more of a credit to your nation than your media is... Seems they are just as bad the Indian media, reading some of the stuff there...

 

[zaremba]

Also, huge props to most Aussie posters here who have shown great sportiveness in accepting this defeat inspite of what seems to be quite a few controversial decisions going against them.. .

Yeah seconded. Decent bunch of crims we've got here, mostly.

 

[tooextracool]

Have to say that you really have to take your hats off to the Aussies for the spirit and competitiveness with which they play their sport. Michael Clarke, when he was dismissed, refused to even look at the crowd or acknowledge their applause on his way back to the dressing room, despite playing one of the most impressive innings this year. Walked back looking at the ground the entire way because he realized that he didn't see his country all the way through. You have to respect that, and it was rather annoying when people like Mark Nicholas say that "he should walk back with his head held high because he scored 136", sorry but thats rubbish, and the sort of attitude that you'd expect from the English players and Pietersen. Even though he played an innings of a lifetime against some excellent bowling, you have to respect the fact that he was disappointed for not seeing Australia home and I'd expect nothing less from any cricketer who plays for his 'team'.

 

[tooextracool]

The one sour note with Flintoff's performance was his blatantly deliberate "front page of tomorrow's paper" poses that he struck after every wicket. Seemed a lot more interested in playing to the cameras than celebrating with his team mates.

Cant believe that this is such a big deal. So what if he's a showman? Who honestly cares? It doesn't take away from his performances, his worth to the team, or how much he is loved by his teammates. He couldn't have done more to the team's cause than what he did yesterday. What are going to do next? Shoot down someone for raising their bat for scoring a 100 instead of hugging his teammate first?

 

[UncleTheOne]

His bowling average is over 32 (which for a pace bowler is terribly average)

yeah career averages, best way to judge how good a bowler is.

 

[tooextracool]

Yeah, he bowled a lot fuller on day five though. Particularly to Siddle- every ball hitting the stumps, when Sid misses one he's gone.

Over his career, his length has been the problem. With his standard length he's only ever going to get batsmen out caught or played on, whereas someone like Steyn brings the clean bowled and lbw into play- especially important to the tail. Flintoff's taken only 68 test wickets out of 225 bowled or lbw- 29.9%- whereas Dale Steyn's taken 67 of 170 by that method (39.4%). I suspect if it weren't for spells like yesterday where Flintoff bowled fuller than usual, the difference would be even more stark.

I think he made a conscious effort to bowl fuller on that final day. It might have been something that Otis Gibson the bowling coach and him discussed, but it was fairly obvious that he came in with the intention of pitching the ball up consistently more than usual. If he bowled on the stumps more often, like he did yesterday, Im sure it would have addressed the issue of the number of 5 wicket hauls hes taken.

 

[Scaly piscine]

I personally like Freddie's celebration. To me he seems like a cool guy and very quick to commiserate and congratulate so his standing arms out is fine IMO. Minimalistic and no overreaction. Like saying, "Yeh, I know I am pretty good".

With regards to his 5fers; I think bowling only 30 to 31 overs a match has limited him. Most frontline bowlers bowl more than that.

Nah. His natural length is too short (as others have said) to run through tailenders, which is something you generally need to get lots of 5-fers. Also he needs something to inspire him to bowl at his best, things like the match situation and a top batsman at the other end. He's an effort bowler, so every bit of adrenalin helps him bowl that bit quicker.

 

[The Sean]

Cant believe that this is such a big deal.

Neither can I, and I'm the one who said it - surprised it's caused such a reaction TBH. Still, it's an opinion and I stand by it. I also don't think for a second it lessens his brilliance yesterday.

 

[Faisal1985]

After a long time i got to see a gem of bowling spell ................Freddy is TOO Good.

Simply Hats off Freddy.

 

[Burgey]

yeah career averages, best way to judge how good a bowler is.

This. Should just judge them when they bowl a cracking spell and ignore it when they're pretty ordinary.

By far a more accurate measure, obviously.

 

[Dick Rockett]

Ha, I find that amusing given that Johnson has taken more wickets this series than Freddie or Anderson.

Hahahaha, whoooosh.

 

[Burgey]

Yeah seconded. Decent bunch of crims we've got here, mostly.

Get ****ed ****!