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Freddie to retire after the Ashes

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
But if he's unfit enough, no amount of painkillers will help matters. Pain is a warning that something isn't right. If his body isn't working well enough, he's a player of no great calibre, and England would be foolhardy to pick him just because he's Flintoff. He should only play if he's fit enough to perform.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
Yes, of course, but the medical staff aren't going to administer an abnormal amount to him. I don't doubt, though, that he will take the long-term hit because he is set for life financially and wants more than anything to get through this series.
He'd find a job in the media somewhere without any doubt at all either, don't think he's quite cut out for working with the Sky Team as he doesn't quite fit their image and I doubt he would really want to do it anyway, but there will always be someone wanting him involved as a personality for something.
 

four_or_six

Cricketer Of The Year
Yeah moreorless exactly my thoughts TBH. Only in a minority of cases is a retirement at 31 the best option, but I'd say it undoubtedly is here.

Yet the reality is that most of the injuries (all the ankle ones if not this latest knee problem) were caused by something entirely within his power to change, which he was advised to change at 24 (may even have been younger actually), and did not.

That's the biggest disappointment for me.
Yet it's another one of those what-if's, I guess. There's players who are told to change their action and it's all a disaster.

Anyway, I'll miss not having him to watch. I've always loved watching all-rounders and it's rarely as exciting to me without Flintoff in the team.
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
But if he's unfit enough, no amount of painkillers will help matters. Pain is a warning that something isn't right. If his body isn't working well enough, he's a player of no great calibre, and England would be foolhardy to pick him just because he's Flintoff. He should only play if he's fit enough to perform.
I don't disagree, but it depends on the injury, I guess. We shall see.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Yet it's another one of those what-if's, I guess. There's players who are told to change their action and it's all a disaster.
It was a question of are you willing to take a relatively small risk with effectiveness to gain the certainty of reducing the likelihood of injury.

Even though even a small tweak can indeed cause mayhem, changing the simple position of the ankle by an eighth of a circle really isn't something you could expect to do much damage.

Flintoff was certainly not like Shane Bond, who had the choice between being a moderate, fit bowler or an excellent one who had no chance ever of staying fit.
 
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four_or_six

Cricketer Of The Year
It was a question of are you willing to take a relatively small risk with effectiveness to gain the certainty of reducing the likelihood of injury.

Even though even a small tweak can indeed cause mayhem, changing the simple position of the ankle by an eighth of a circle really isn't something you could expect to do much damage.

Flintoff was certainly not like Shane Bond, who had the choice between being a moderate, fit bowler or an excellent one who had no chance ever of staying fit.
If it was really that simple, I find it hard to believe he didn't try it.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
So do I. The reason that's been given for it not being tried is "they decided it'd always been that way so there was no need to change". AFAIC, it was a pretty silly thing to do (or rather not do). But there we go. That sort of thing is all part of the Flintoff package.
 

Son Of Coco

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
True, and it's funny how little anyone cares. Maybe he should have been born in another country.
I don't think that's necessarily true. I think he's well-respected in Australia and liked by a great number of people. Personally I'd rate him quite highly, but I think the fact that he's been injured so frequently makes it hard to get a grasp on exactly what he has achieved as those of us in countries other than England haven't seen him as often as we would have liked. I don't follow English cricket either, so I don't keep up-to-date on everything that happens. He was awesome in England in 2005 though and I have seen his over to Kallis which was outstanding. He's a top-class player when fit and great to watch.

The idea of Flintoff being fit at the start of this Ashes series and ready to play 5 matches was something that made me wonder if we could win. I thought if he and Pietersen played well and had good backup from other players then they were a great chance. Needless to say, I'm not totally devastated he may not play all 5. But I hope he gets a good send-off from the format.
 
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_Ed_

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Apparently he plans to play through to the 2015 World Cup!

Good luck to him.
 

Son Of Coco

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Apparently he plans to play through to the 2015 World Cup!

Good luck to him.
Yeah, I hope he has a few good years injury free. I'd prefer to see him in Tests because I think that's where he really stands out when he's at his best. Nothing better than seeing someone good enough to tear a team apart when they have the option to be on the defensive. But I can understand him wanting to play ODI's and Twenty20 instead. The latter in particular because he can get quite a bit of money from it.
 

pasag

RTDAS
Haha, why stop there?

It's interesting because there's still going to be crazy speculation on a Test comeback untill he fully retires, especially if he's gunning it at the limited overs stuff similar to Warne before the 2007 World Cup.
 

Son Of Coco

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Haha, why stop there?

It's interesting because there's still going to be crazy speculation on a Test comeback untill he fully retires, especially if he's gunning it at the limited overs stuff similar to Warne before the 2007 World Cup.
Yeah, I wonder if England will be able to resist the temptation to try to recall him if they don't find a suitable replacement and he's going well.
 

pskov

International 12th Man
freddie has one of the best records for an all-rounder in ODI cricket - way better than kapil, botham, chris cairns and, brace yourself for the big one, the great imran khan himself.

he would be, along with kallis, klusener and jayasuriya, among the top 5 ODI cricketers of all time. too bad his team has not won too many trophies to help this claim,.

Never really considered that but it's a good point. Not sure about top 5 ODI players of all time because that is probably too difficult to call, but I'd say you'd be hard pressed to say he hasn't been England's greatest ODI cricketer in his career to date. 32.01 batting average at a 88.82 strike rate and 24.38 bowling average with an excellent 4.39 economy considering his era.
 

bagapath

International Captain
Never really considered that but it's a good point. Not sure about top 5 ODI players of all time because that is probably too difficult to call, but I'd say you'd be hard pressed to say he hasn't been England's greatest ODI cricketer in his career to date. 32.01 batting average at a 88.82 strike rate and 24.38 bowling average with an excellent 4.39 economy considering his era.
my bad. i meant to say top 5 one day all rounders of all time.
 

DaRick

State Vice-Captain
Well, at his best, he was an utter monolith - able to tear attacks apart with the bat, able to bowl his heart out and incur crucial breakthroughs and able to field adeptly in the slips (and even on the outfield). His mere presence could inspire lesser lights in the team. His performance during the 2005 Ashes, much as I hate to admit it, was close to perfect (arguably bettered only by Johnson's performance in SA since).

Unfortunately, he wasn't at his best all that often. There were a few reasons for this. For one, he was amongst the most injury-prone cricketers out there. Plus, his batting was flawed - his technique was decent against the quicks, but against spin he was utterly suspect (sometimes failing to pick variations and tending to run down the pitch like a deranged madman). He rarely ran through sides with the ball, either. He looked good hurling it down at a back-of-a-length, was often economical and was a partnership breaker of some renown, but you couldn't reasonably call him a strike bowler. In a team with a more reliable strike bowler, he probably would've done somewhat better - compare his performances nowadays to when Harmison was at his best (during 2004 and some of 2005), for instance.

He probably suffered, like Broad may be now, for being introduced into Test cricket some years before he was ready. He debuted in 1998 and arguably only become a viable Test selection in 2003. Add to that his fitness issues at that time (being too fat) and you can see why his record is still a touch underwhelming.

But anyway, I wish him the best for the future. This is still a loss for England, although not as big as it would've been say, four years ago.
 

vic_orthdox

Global Moderator
Has he said what he's going to do with regards to Lancs? Will he play four day stuff for them, or only OD and Twenty20 for them too?
 

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