Produced is key here. I don't think the Associates can claim to have produced Gavin Hamilton or Ryan ten Doeschate.Who is the best batsman that Associate teams have produced?
I thought he was genuinely Scottish?Produced is key here. I don't think the Associates can claim to have produced Gavin Hamilton or Ryan ten Doeschate.
Tikolo, O'Brien, Morgan, Joyce - maybe. Though with the last 3, they've certainly had a fair bit of help from the County circuit too.
He is, but I'd argue that he learned his trade at Yorkshire.I thought he was genuinely Scottish?
Yes Hamilton defo was a product of Yorkshire played there from his late teens.He is, but I'd argue that he learned his trade at Yorkshire.
If Hamilton counts, then I would definitely put forward Brian Hardie. Mind you, Brian Hardie actually played for Scotland well before he played for Essex - 'touring' England with the Scotland team in 1970, 71 and 72. Including 2 centuries against a touring MCC side in Aberdeen [when the MCC came to Scotland, of course!]
Yeah, that's what I thought. So I'd hesitate to say he was "produced" by Scotland.Yes Hamilton defo was a product of Yorkshire played there from his late teens.
Mahadevan Sathasivam of course.Who is the best batsman that Associate teams have produced?
Steve Tikolo
Thomas Odoyo
Ten Doeschate
Gavin Hamilton
Kevin O Brian
Ashish Bagai
or others
Calling Australia associates now?Dean Brownlie looked alright.
I think that's a distinction that doesn't need to be made. For a batsman from an associate nation to be considered as a good one, people wait to see him perform well in the more established competitions. At which point, it can be claimed that the higher class of competition and better system had a hand in his development, which then means he wasn't an exclusive product of his home nation. It would be pretty rare for a batsman to be considered good if his performances in the associate circuit are all he has by way of claim.Produced is key here. I don't think the Associates can claim to have produced Gavin Hamilton or Ryan ten Doeschate.
Tikolo, O'Brien, Morgan, Joyce - maybe. Though with the last 3, they've certainly had a fair bit of help from the County circuit too.
Would you hesitate to say that Pietersen and Trott were "produced" by South Africa?Yeah, that's what I thought. So I'd hesitate to say he was "produced" by Scotland.
*groans*Looks as if Team USA will be without their best batsman for a while -
USA news: USA captain Massiah arrested in fraud case | USA Cricket News | ESPN Cricinfo
"He's not the Messiah, he's a very naughty boy!"
Yes and no. ten Doeschate was brought up in South Africa, learned his trade in South Africa and is a South African with Dutch heritage that plays for the Netherlands. He's clearly not a 'product' of Holland. With your argument, I think it probably becomes necessary to drill into the earlier careers of some of the Irish players. I certainly think a couple of them were picked up by counties because of their exploits for Ireland, whilst some of them were picked up by counties before they performed for Ireland; though I admit it's a bit of a grey area with them as to who 'produced' them.I think that's a distinction that doesn't need to be made. For a batsman from an associate nation to be considered as a good one, people wait to see him perform well in the more established competitions. At which point, it can be claimed that the higher class of competition and better system had a hand in his development, which then means he wasn't an exclusive product of his home nation. It would be pretty rare for a batsman to be considered good if his performances in the associate circuit are all he has by way of claim.