Australia a country with no culture: David Gower

[CWB304]

Good post, but both in the post you're responding to and in the subsequent one I made it clear that it's not "ockerism" that I'm objecting to. As others have pointed out there is an equivalent 'lower-class-behaviour stereotype' in every country on earth. It is the fact that such behaviour seems to be accepted and even applauded when it is manifested in the public square, and that even persons in positions of authority and responsibility, who should be setting an example to others often play up to this stereotype by their oafish behaviour. Australia is pretty unique to my knowledge in this respect. In case you're wondering I'm thinking more of politicians like John Howard than the likes of David Warner, of whom perhaps not much better should be expected ;-), when citing instances of this type of behaviour.

 

[Ruckus]

Good post, but both in the post you're responding to and in the subsequent one I made it clear that it's not "ockerism" that I'm objecting to. As others have pointed out there is an equivalent 'lower-class-behaviour stereotype' in every country on earth. It is the fact that such behaviour seems to be accepted and even applauded when it is manifested in the public square, and that even persons in positions of authority and responsibility, who should be setting an example to others often play up to this stereotype by their oafish behaviour. Australia is pretty unique to my knowledge in this respect. In case you're wondering I'm thinking more of politicians like John Howard than the likes of David Warner, of whom perhaps not much better should be expected ;-), when citing instances of this type of behaviour.

So your citing examples of politicians displaying oafish behavior as evidence for your argument? I'm sorry, but what country in the world doesn't have idiotic politicians?

 

[Adders]

So your citing examples of politicians displaying oafish behavior as evidence for your argument? I'm sorry, but what country in the world doesn't have idiotic politicians?

Not many have any in the Guinness Book of Records for sculling beer.

And I think you are confusing idiotic with oafish.

 

[watson]

Good post, but both in the post you're responding to and in the subsequent one I made it clear that it's not "ockerism" that I'm objecting to. As others have pointed out there is an equivalent 'lower-class-behaviour stereotype' in every country on earth. It is the fact that such behaviour seems to be accepted and even applauded when it is manifested in the public square, and that even persons in positions of authority and responsibility, who should be setting an example to others often play up to this stereotype by their oafish behaviour. Australia is pretty unique to my knowledge in this respect. In case you're wondering I'm thinking more of politicians like John Howard than the likes of David Warner, of whom perhaps not much better should be expected ;-), when citing instances of this type of behaviour.

OK, I think I see where you are coming from. According to neo-liberal thought - conservative politicians like John Howard unfairly wield their political power by harnessing the intrinsic xenophobia of boorish Anglo-Celtic Australians.

To which I reply - "You may very well say that, but I couldn't possibly comment."

 

[uvelocity]

Not many have any in the Guinness Book of Records for sculling beer.

And I think you are confusing idiotic with oafish.

rather a record like that than one for most number of plumbs in ones mouth or carrots up ones rectum

 

[the big bambino]

Politicians, officials, public figures in general take pride in being boorish, oafish and bumptious. Basically uncouth. Think of someone like John Howard. And, speaking of Howard, or rather his entourage, where else but Australia would you hear of an official opposition party hosting a fundraising dinner featuring the following menu item: "Julia Gillard [Australia's Prime Minister] Kentucky Fried Quail: Small Breasts and Huge Thighs and A Big Red Box"? Pure misogyny of the most basic and hateful kind, which can hardly be passed off as the work of chavs/bogans who can be found in every country. These people are supposed to be your elites, for crying out loud! The place must be almost unbearable for anyone with delicate sensibilities, and every time I read such a story I recall what my exiled Australian friends (all but one of whom works in the arts) have said about living there.

I hate to puncture the smug worldly opinion you have of yourself but John Howard has been retired since 2007. So he couldn't have been involved in this incident in any way. Neither was his party by the way. The restaurant owner has admitted it was he who wrote up the menu as a private joke. The menu wasn't disseminated at the fund raiser and only got out to the public via a series of events facilitated on a private facebook page. At this stage you'd be thinking you might apologise or retract. For some reason admitting error isn't a virtue of the smug so your embarrassed silence will serve as an adequate substitute.

Drawing attention to these aspects is neither racist,.

When you claim boorish politicians and chavs/bogans are a peculiarity of one people instead of a common failing in all countries then yes; yes you can say it is racist.

 

[Pothas]

How is this thread still going?

 

[grecian]

I have some relations, who I've never met on Facebook who are Aussies.

One of them just won an order of merit thingy, rather crassly boasting about it. Vulgar I think.

She seems like someone who would be properly put in her place in Blighty. Makes me worried for the gens of my family, to be frank.

 

[the big bambino]

I have some relations, who I've never met on Facebook who are Aussies.

One of them just won an order of merit thingy, rather crassly boasting about it. Vulgar I think.

She seems like someone who would be properly put in her place in Blighty. Makes me worried for the gens of my family, to be frank.

So you've only ever met them face to face? I fear that people will lose their computing skills if this trend continues.

 

[Langeveldt]

Does it really matter? For once Gower can pick on Australia's lack of ability on the cricket field and he reverts to mudslinging? Everywhere can have a distinct lack of culture anyway, has Mr Gower ever walked down Gloucester high street on a Friday night? Glass houses...

 

[grecian]

So you've only ever met them face to face? I fear that people will lose their computing skills if this trend continues.

Good point,bad puncuation, I've never met IRL, because my grandad scarpered down their, leaving his pregnant misses with two young kids. I think we're well rid TBH.

 

[CWB304]

I hate to puncture the smug worldly opinion you have of yourself but John Howard has been retired since 2007. So he couldn't have been involved in this incident in any way. Neither was his party by the way. The restaurant owner has admitted it was he who wrote up the menu as a private joke. The menu wasn't disseminated at the fund raiser and only got out to the public via a series of events facilitated on a private facebook page. At this stage you'd be thinking you might apologise or retract. For some reason admitting error isn't a virtue of the smug so your embarrassed silence will serve as an adequate substitute.



When you claim boorish politicians and chavs/bogans are a peculiarity of one people instead of a common failing in all countries then yes; yes you can say it is racist.

1. What difference does it make when Howard retired? I'm well aware that he hasn't been involved in politics for a long time, and despite your sneaky attempt to suggest otherwise, I nowhere accused him of direct involvement in the incident. But the fact of the matter is that the incident involved members of his party who are clearly carrying on in his oafish tradition, and that is why it forced me to associate the name of the oaf-in-chief and his present-day successors .

2. Yahoo! News UK & Ireland - Latest World News & UK News Headlines
With respect to the restaurant owner's belated "admission", firstly, the account I read makes it clear that this latest incident is just the latest in a series showing a pattern of ***ist and misogynistic behaviour by the (so-called) Liberals against Gillard. Secondly, "wrote up the menu as a private joke" sounds to me like someone sacrificing himself to get some powerful customers out of a jam. I'm not convinced, but, even if it were true, it would make absolutely no difference to the point I was making. Which is that, regardless of whether or not the menu was approved by party officials, the fact that whoever was responsible for the hilarious "joke" believed that it lay within the pale of acceptability, and would even be appreciated by leading Australian politicians, speaks to the extent to which your bogan problem eclipses that of any other nation I can think of. In a civilized country no one outwith the sorts of characters one sees depicted in TV shows like Underbelly would assume that such a crude and completely tasteless "joke" would be acceptable in some sort of formal setting. No one. Yes, perhaps one might here and there come across such 'humour' between mates on a fishing trip, or having a drink after rugby, or whatever. But in a room full of people wearing suits and ties? No way! If that's typical aussie humour, then you guys need to take tips from the Germans.

3. You clearly do not undertand what racism is. That you disagree with my view that your chavs/bogans refresh the parts that other countries' chavs/bogans cannot reach is one thing; that you extrapolate from that that my point of view is therefore racist is absurd and illogical. I have already made it clear that I accept that all countries have this class of person, and that I'm not judging Oz becuase it has bogans or ockers or whatever. If anything our chavs are, as someone who's seen them on holiday in the mediterranean has pointed out, are far worse! But I have also backed up what I'm actually saying, which is that Australia's problem is that its chavism is not confined to the 'lower orders' - by giving a number of examples, and not just involving politicians ;-) In Australia sadly this class of person and this type of behaviour is not confined to awful slums, inner city dumps or backward rural areas but is actually embodied in 'respectable' persons with supposedly responsible jobs. Rather than playing the victim by whining (all too predictably) about my supposed anti-Aussie racism(!) ;-), why not come out with similar examples of non-chav people in the UK behaving in similar ways. I suspect you'll be hard-pressed to do so because, as I intimated earlier, the chav ethos has not permeated throughout the society in this country as it has in Oz.

As I've already said to another poster, it's a shame that you seem to feel I'm picking on Australia, rather than pointing out an uncomfortable truth. The day I heard about the prank call to the hospital, the day I read about the incident on the bus involving the French tourists, the day (today) I read about the menu item, I immediately recalled what my Australian friends have told me about your country. It is clear that they are not isolated incidents, but part of a pattern. Rather than getting defensive and even excusing such behaviour you need to be looking for ways of eradicating it if you want to develop, enrich and extend civilized discourse in your beautiful country.

 

[zaremba]

Does it really matter? For once Gower can pick on Australia's lack of ability on the cricket field and he reverts to mudslinging? Everywhere can have a distinct lack of culture anyway, has Mr Gower ever walked down Gloucester high street on a Friday night? Glass houses...

Reminds me of a Frank Skinner line from some years back - "I hear they're selling Fred and Rose West's old house. Can you imagine ? What a place to live! ... Gloucester."

 

[sameolds]

who gives a ****.
I nobbed david gowers wife once when I was in the uk while he was on tour.
if we ever need culture he had plenty to spare in his drawing room.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

who gives a ****.
I nobbed david gowers wife once when I was in the uk while he was on tour.
if we ever need culture he had plenty to spare in his drawing room.

Nice opening post.

 

[Langeveldt]

Four off the first ball

 

[grecian]

Four off the first ball

Gower's Test career started that way, was a lot more elegant though, TBF.

 

[Spikey]

Four off the first ball

6 imo. strong username/av

 

[GIMH]

 

[the big bambino]

1. What difference does it make when Howard retired? .

Sorry; lost interest after that point. If you have no respect for facts then I don't see why I should waste time with the rest of it.