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Can anyone tell me when...

Langeveldt

Soutie
chris.hinton said:
Why does anyone think that Harmy is over rated
Because we have seen what absolutely appaling dross the guy is capable of bowling, for extended periods lets not forget, and are not "jumping the gun" when it comes to rating him..
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
The thing is though that he has modified his action and is now consistently bowling anything but dross.
 

Rik

Cricketer Of The Year
marc71178 said:
So in spite of so many superb performance, Rik STILL cannot accept that Harmison is a good bowler.
I broke my rule, but then, I thought, why not?

Marc, where did I say that? Where? Come on, someone show me! This is why arguing with you is like hitting your head against a solid brick wall, you never get anything out of it other than a headache. Doesn't look like you've changed one bit, still posting about what you think rather than what's in front of you, still having a go at people for saying things they didn't say...and STILL not posting about the topic, which you can see in this thread! Do us all a favour and get a life, because believe me, it's worth it.
 

Rik

Cricketer Of The Year
Mr Mxyzptlk said:
Please do tell what he is saying then.
Well people seem to have forgotten opening post in this thread then! I was asking when they are getting married because I'm tired of all the flirting and adoring looks and I want concrete evidence that Mark Nicholas is truely in love with him and wants him to be his one and only :)
 

Langeveldt

Soutie
Rik said:
still posting about what you think rather than what's in front of you,

But what is in front of him? A changed bowler who has just destroyed the West Indies (on numerous occasions), averages in the low twenties and is ranked, oh number two...
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
But seemingly cannot be praised by anyone because Rik (who conveniently disappeared when he was proven wrong) doesn't like him.
 

Mr Mxyzptlk

Request Your Custom Title Now!
Rik said:
Well people seem to have forgotten opening post in this thread then! I was asking when they are getting married because I'm tired of all the flirting and adoring looks and I want concrete evidence that Mark Nicholas is truely in love with him and wants him to be his one and only :)
Ah, in that case, no harm in asking. :) Welcome back Rik... even if in limited capacity.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
marc71178 said:
But seemingly cannot be praised by anyone because Rik (who conveniently disappeared when he was proven wrong) doesn't like him.
Same way I apparently "conveniently" disappeared for the same reason, despite the fact I reappeared when nothing had changed?
And funny, isn't it, how the same ludicrous ideas are used to attempt to dismiss those of the same view. Why on Earth would someone just decide not to like someone, then try to make them look like the right view?
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
What on Earth makes you think that?
Harmison's figures were very, very poor for most of the time he played against those teams that deserve Test-status before the West Indies tour. For the first 3 innings of the Australia series he averaged 100; for the first 5 of the South Africa one over 70. The fact that people talked about someone who was clearly very, very poor as if he was very, very good was so ludicrous is beggared belief.
Fortunately for those who were saying it, it's looked much more like the case since that Caribbean Test-series.
 

Tom Halsey

International Coach
He always had bags of talent, though - he may have been inaccurate, but he was quick, and if he worked on his accuracy, I always thought he would be a good bowler.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Yes, but the point is people were still talking as if it was a formality that he'd start getting figures like those he's got in 6 of the last 7 matches, and during that time he was getting figures like those.
It was so bad it defied belief.
And anyway, as I said it's not as if becoming more accurate instantly made him a better bowlers. He bowled about 60 overs of accurate stuff before the wickets started coming, and as I say they started with a leg-cutter that could not possibly have been deliberate and a poor lbw decision.
 

Tom Halsey

International Coach
True, but those 60 overs of accuracy only backed up people's views that it was only a matter of time before the wickets came.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
And still, I might remind you, they've come mostly through poor strokes.
How long have people been saying "the wickets will come" with regards Flintoff?
 

Tom Halsey

International Coach
A long time - and they're quite clearly beginning to be proven right.

I don't see how you can say that most of Harmison's wicket's have been poor strokes - I assume you still say he bowled well.
 

Protea

School Boy/Girl Captain
Richard said:
How long have people been saying "the wickets will come" with regards Flintoff?
6 years. Since his test debut against South Africa in 1998 to be exact 8-)
 

superkingdave

Hall of Fame Member
Flintoff Himself says

"It's only since then (2001) that I've been able to practise my bowling as I would like to practise," says Flintoff, who has felt his body becoming stronger as he gets older. "In some ways I'm quite an inexperienced bowler, because even though I'm 26 I've been bowling for only two-and-a-half years."
 

Langeveldt

Soutie
How was Stephen Harmison considered "talented"?

I dont call a guy who sprays it round very talented, but credit to him for turning things around..
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Richard said:
The fact that people talked about someone who was clearly very, very poor as if he was very, very good was so ludicrous is beggared belief.

Erm, nobody actually did that - what we said was we could see why he'd been selected, and also pointed out that he was still performing better than the rest of the attack.

There is a massive difference.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Richard said:
Yes, but the point is people were still talking as if it was a formality that he'd start getting figures like those he's got in 6 of the last 7 matches, and during that time he was getting figures like those.

No, we weren't.

What we were saying was that we were prepared to back Fletcher and selector's judgement on him, seeing as they obviously kept picking him for a reason.

The fact still remains that even when he wasn't as successful, he was still performing better than the team as a whole, so there were other's in more need of the chop than him.
 

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