Bad Captains

[Bijed]

I'm sure most of you will have seen the news that Alastair Cook has resigned as captain of the England Test side. Now, I never had particular issue with his captaincy, but I know there's many who did not rate him at all.

My question is: which international captains over the history of the sport, across all formats, do you really not rate, and by not rate I don't mean you though/think they're average, I mean you think you think they're outright bad. Who do you hold in such low esteem, and why?

 

[OverratedSanity]

Cronje and Azharuddin

 

[Red]

Dont think there have been too many bad captains at international level, tbh. You have to have something going for you to get to that level. Obviously the ones who have cheated have been "bad" by a different definition.

Think there's two types of captains at international level: the leader of men, and the astute tactician. Most international captains are one or the other. The ones who have combined both have been the greatest captains.

 

[fredfertang]

Ian Botham - not really his fault though - he had the captaincy thrust at him far too soon against the best team in the world at a time when he had no captaincy experience to speak of and was England's leading batsman and bowler. To be fair to the selectors they had little in the way of options as is illustrated by Bob Willis getting the job after they briefly persuaded Brearley to come back, but they still shouldn't have offered him the job.

Ironically I always thought that later in his career, once his bowling was desperately ordinary, the captaincy would have made him as a batsman, but sadly because he couldn't resist being a ****, and the tabloids wouldn't leave him alone, he never looked like getting the job back

 

[mackembhoy]

Giving Flintoff and Pietersen the captaincy still makes no sense.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Flintoff was pretty ordinary, I thought. Tactically short and, allegedly, three sheets to the wind for most of his mercifully brief reign.

The selectors' reason for anointing him rather than Strauss was utterly wrong headed too; if memory serves it was reported he got the nod because it "meant more" to him. One doesn't need to be Alan Turing to decode the message as "Fred would've had a massive monk on for the Ashes"...

 

[fredfertang]

Flintoff was pretty ordinary, I thought. Tactically short and, allegedly, three sheets to the wind for most of his mercifully brief reign.

The selectors' reason for anointing him rather than Strauss was utterly wrong headed too; if memory serves it was reported he got the nod because it "meant more" to him. One doesn't need to be Alan Turing to decode the message as "Fred would've had a massive monk on for the Ashes"...

I think for once the selectors allowed themselves to be affected by sentiment and got caught up in the public euphoria over oor Freddie - I desperately wanted him to get the job myself, but looking back in the cold light of 5-0 it was always going to be a disaster

 

[Red]

I think for once the selectors allowed themselves to be affected by sentiment and got caught up in the public euphoria over oor Freddie - I desperately wanted him to get the job myself, but looking back in the cold light of 5-0 it was always going to be a disaster

I think having your talisman player as captain is always fraught with danger. Especially one whose best (which is so so good) is so far removed from their worst,as is Freddie's.

 

[Bijed]

Dont think there have been too many bad captains at international level, tbh. You have to have something going for you to get to that level. Obviously the ones who have cheated have been "bad" by a different definition.

Think there's two types of captains at international level: the leader of men, and the astute tactician. Most international captains are one or the other. The ones who have combined both have been the greatest captains.

Fair point, there probably aren't many who did the job over a somewhat extended period who are outright poor, though I'd have thought maybe there were a few more who possibly ended up as captain through slightly contrived circumstances and/or maybe got it based purely on their ability as a player who turned out to be basically bad at the job.

 

[Athlai]

In before mass kiwi whinging about Kane.

 

[wpdavid]

By all accounts Allan Lamb was shockingly poor when he briefly replaced the injured Graham Gooch in the WI back in 1990. Well, according to Mathew Engel, which is usually good enough for me.

I always thought Keith Fletcher a totally uninspiring choice to lead the side to India and SL back in 1981/82.

 

[Shri]

Cronje and Azharuddin

And Salman Butt.

Tendulkar was a bad captain. Maybe even Ross Taylor.

 

[mr_mister]

What about Jimmy Adams? Or was that more a case of having ****e players

 

[smash84]

Tendulkar was a really bad captain, probably the worst captain among all top tier players(along with waqar younis).

I have a long list to choose from in Pakistan. Waqar Younis and Aamir sohail that come to mind

 

[Athlai]

And Salman Butt.

Tendulkar was a bad captain. Maybe even Ross Taylor.

Taylor was a poor man manager, a great performer (as captain) and a mediocre on field tactician. Dunno if you'd necessarily call that out as being particularly bad. Reckon hes possibly better than Kane.

 

[Daemon]

Ian Botham - not really his fault though - he had the captaincy thrust at him far too soon against the best team in the world at a time when he had no captaincy experience to speak of and was England's leading batsman and bowler. To be fair to the selectors they had little in the way of options as is illustrated by Bob Willis getting the job after they briefly persuaded Brearley to come back, but they still shouldn't have offered him the job.

Ironically I always thought that later in his career, once his bowling was desperately ordinary, the captaincy would have made him as a batsman, but sadly because he couldn't resist being a ****, and the tabloids wouldn't leave him alone, he never looked like getting the job back

Actually got an ebook of Brearly's Art of Captaincy lying around, worth a read? Seems like he really brought the best out of Botham and Willis.

 

[honestbharani]

Include Salim Malik to the list of Azhar, Cronje and Salman Butt.


Agree that Sachin was very bad as captain. Add in Atapattu? I just always felt he did less with a good side.

 

[Burgey]

Actually got an ebook of Brearly's Art of Captaincy lying around, worth a read? Seems like he really brought the best out of Botham and Willis.

Yeah it's a great book. Well worth a read.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Mathews is pretty bad tactically. Makes some baffling on field decisions.

 

[jimmy101]

From what we've seen. how do people rate Holder's captaincy credentials? Thumbs up or thumbs down?