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All-Time World XIs: Discussion Thread

Johan

Hall of Fame Member
@Thala_0710 Also, what seprates Greenidge from Boycott and even Gavaskar is that he completely failed in the home of his strongest opposition, Australia and Pakistan, had he averaged 45+ in Australia and 35+ in Pakistan he'd be compared to Gavaskar but his failure knocks him two or three levels below.
 

PlayerComparisons

International Captain
Most of Boycotts career was before the really hard era started tbh but Greenidge also avoided the reason why his era was so hard. They’re at a similar level though.
 

Johan

Hall of Fame Member
at the end of the day, Boycott is some 48 averaging opener from England and Gavaskar a 50 averaging one from India, same era, successful away or home, similar career lengths and no real conditional deficiency in their record. All there is to it, period.
 

kyear2

Hall of Fame Member
@kyear2 please answer. It's a genuine question, not in any was trying to annoy you.
Barry actually played test cricket, played in the ROW tests, WSC and in county cricket which was the preeminent competition at the time and held an even greater place than odi's hold now as a secondary ranking for players. He even played in Australia for one season and broke every record.

He was exposed to and proved himself vs every great bowler of the era, and they accordingly rate him as the best of the era.

And if course one was the best batsman in the world for more than half a decade.

Van Der Bijl didnt have any of that. Nebe played tests and primarily stayed home and played in SA.

They're not comparable
 

subshakerz

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
at the end of the day, Boycott is some 48 averaging opener from England and Gavaskar a 50 averaging one from India, same era, successful away or home, similar career lengths and no real conditional deficiency in their record. All there is to it, period.
You rate Gavaskar ahead I recall
 

Thala_0710

International Captain
@Thala_0710 Also, what seprates Greenidge from Boycott and even Gavaskar is that he completely failed in the home of his strongest opposition, Australia and Pakistan, had he averaged 45+ in Australia and 35+ in Pakistan he'd be compared to Gavaskar but his failure knocks him two or three levels below.
Agree with Aus, but Pak had some ridiculously low scoring games in the first series he played in... And then his second tour was his last test tour ever.... (Again very low scoring btw) where he couldn't bat against any one anyway.. Never toured Pak in the first 11 years of his career when he was at his best... So don't hold that too much against him
 

Johan

Hall of Fame Member
I have more issues with the 84 WI series.
nah like I meant, Hadlee's big tour to India is also extremely low scoring and in a period where India was in transition, the batting average in his tour of India is 23, the batting average in Ambrose's series in Pakistan is 20, so I really think the same issue with Ambrose to Pak in 1990 applies to Hadlee to ind in 88.
 

subshakerz

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Barry actually played test cricket, played in the ROW tests, WSC and in county cricket which was the preeminent competition at the time and held an even greater place than odi's hold now as a secondary ranking for players. He even played in Australia for one season and broke every record.

He was exposed to and proved himself vs every great bowler of the era, and they accordingly rate him as the best of the era.

And if course one was the best batsman in the world for more than half a decade.

Van Der Bijl didnt have any of that. Nebe played tests and primarily stayed home and played in SA.

They're not comparable
Huh? Van Der Bijl played extensively in the county circuit and had the rep of the best medium pacer of the era.

You are saying he can't be rated but Barry can because of 4 tests?That's a joke.
 

Johan

Hall of Fame Member
Agree with Aus, but Pak had some ridiculously low scoring games in the first series he played in... And then his second tour was his last test tour ever... Where he couldn't bat anyway.. Never toured Pak in the first 11 years of his career when he was at his best... So don't hold that too much against him
I get that, but no amount of adjustment is going to solve a 17 average, Imran, Viv, Raza, Miandad, Haynes etc all did miles better. He failed in the home series against Pakistan in 80s too. Big holes in the record, nowhere near Boycott.
 

subshakerz

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
nah like I meant, Hadlee's big tour to India is also extremely low scoring and in a period where India was in transition, the batting average in his tour of India is 23, the batting average in Ambrose's series in Pakistan is 20, so I really think the same issue with Ambrose to Pak in 1990 applies to Hadlee to ind in 88.
Well I have argued that Hadlees record is too much focused on Aus, Eng and NZ, with 70 percent of his cricket there.

And yes, in Ind and Pak he only has one great series out of three.
 

subshakerz

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
and that happened to be an uber low scoring series vs a lineup through transition, same issue as Ambrose, never priven on conventional slow Asian wickets.
Well at least you are seeing the light on Ambrose.

But I agree on Hadlee too. Probably why I think McGrath was slightly better in SC.
 

Thala_0710

International Captain
I get that, but no amount of adjustment is going to solve a 17 average, Imran, Viv, Raza, Miandad, Haynes etc all did miles better. He failed in the home series against Pakistan in 80s too. Big holes in the record, nowhere near Boycott.
He does have some obvious holes in his record... But Boycott has deficiencies in his game as well
 

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