All-Time World XIs: Discussion Thread

[Johan]

Well at least you are seeing the light on Ambrose.

But I agree on Hadlee too. Probably why I think McGrath was slightly better in SC.

I've always agreed he has an issue I just think he's great for other reasons, not his ****ing SC record

 

[sayon basak]

Yeah by a little bit.

Top 10 and Top 30.

 

[Johan]

He does have some obvious holes... But Boycott has defencies in his game as well

Not in his record, In his game? sure, limited strokemaking, but it doesn't mean anything when he's winning games and making runs.

 

[subshakerz]

Not really, iirc he only played 1 county season in 1980 (exceptional season though) and then 1 game in 1981.

Ok but he was phenomenally successful in that 1980 season for Middlesex and was voted a Wisden Cricketer of the Year.

 

[Thala_0710]

Ok but he was phenomenally successful in that 1980 season for Middlesex and was voted a Wisden Cricketer of the Year.

That's true

 

[subshakerz]

I've always agreed he has an issue I just think he's great for other reasons, not his ****ing SC record

Of course he's great.

 

[PlayerComparisons]

Ok but he was phenomenally successful in that 1980 season for Middlesex and was voted a Wisden Cricketer of the Year.

He was compared to Garner that season iirc

 

[Thala_0710]

That's true

But Barry has 10 seasons of an exceptional record in County cricket + the great SA domestic record ofc + a 110 avg season in Aus as well

 

[kyear2]

Yes and the reason he isn't negotiable is the same stat ranking logic. You don't care about team composition when it comes down to it.

It isn't though.

 

[Thala_0710]

Not in his record, In his game? sure, limited strokemaking, but it doesn't mean anything when he's winning games and making runs.

He was making runs, he won a few games too... That's why he's rated highly... But the way he played and the SR impacted his team definitely as well

 

[kyear2]

I have issues with Hadlee's 1988-89 India tour for the same reason you've issues with Ambrose 1990 Pakistan series

Very much a team in transition.

 

[Johan]

He was making runs, he won a few games too... That's why he's rated highly... But the way he played and the SR impacted his team definitely as well

maybe in Three-Days County Cricket, not at all in Five Day Test Cricket

 

[subshakerz]

It isn't though.

It is. You consider him the second best bowler. Hence you vote on bowler ranking despite you admitting that you already have a bowler like him in Hadlee and best attacks are varied.

You lecture about team composition but don't vote accordingly.

 

[kyear2]

I have more issues with the 84 WI series.

So both then.

 

[subshakerz]

But Barry has 10 seasons of an exceptional record in County cricket + the great SA domestic record ofc + a 110 avg season in Aus as well

That's not my debate on if Barry is better it's whether he would consider Van Der Bijl a great. I have asked him if he would select him in his ATG XI and he has refused to answer. Van Der Bijl clearly had a great reputation almost like Barry

 

[subshakerz]

So both then.

McGrath has the SA problem though. In some ways more serious.

 

[Johan]

McGrath has the SA problem though. In some ways more serious.

such an overrated issue

 

[Thala_0710]

That's not my debate on if Barry is better it's whether he would consider Van Der Bijl a great. I have asked him if he would select him in his ATG XI and he has refused to answer. Van Der Bijl clearly had a great reputation almost like Barry

I'll let him answer.... But just imo, Van der Bijl should get voted in our XIs at some point (not before Rabada imo). He has a very good reputation... Not high as Barry's though but most importantly not as tested in the domestic circuit as Barry... Which is why I don't have him as high

 

[kyear2]

That's not my debate on if Barry is better it's whether he would consider Van Der Bijl a great. I have asked him if he would select him in his ATG XI and he has refused to answer. Van Der Bijl clearly had a great reputation almost like Barry

He really doesn't.

Show me 10 players who think he's the greatest bowler ever, or the greatest they've seen and I will consider their reputations almost equal.

 

[Johan]

It's okay to rate guys like Barry and Van Der Bijl extremely high if you think they had ATG skill level but rating them over either elite ATG Test careers or ATG test careers is a fantasy.