All-Time World XIs: Discussion Thread

[Johan]

Two best players of spin in history, in one team. (bar Bradman ofc)

 

[kyear2]

Bradman got results with an ATG side already.

So did Viv

 

[Johan]

looks like only one guy took a war ravaged nation to greatness...

 

[Randomfan]

If I have to pick realistic 2nd XI with logical sequence,

IK and Murali are default choice
Steyn makes the cut for me to due to having proven ability to crank it up on any surface.
Miller makes it to not make tail too long
Ambrose for 5th spot for me. He will simply tie up one end and make life very hard for batsmen. Any uneven bounce, he will rip apart batting line ups.

Out of all these bowlers, Steyn is the only one with a track record of runnning through batting sides in all conditions and producing match/series changing spells. He could make the best use of new ball with his outswingers and then also use the old ball extremely well for reverse. Take him out from this attack and team loses that ability of one bowler able to do that.

 

[Johan]

If I have to pick realistic 2nd XI with logical sequence,

IK and Murali are default choice
Steyn makes the cut for me to due to having proven ability to crank it up on any surface and run thorugh batting sides in different conditions.
Miller makes it to not make tail too long
Ambrose for 5th spot for me.

Out of all these bowlers, Steyn is the only one with a track record of runnning through batting sides in all conditions and producing match/series changing spells. He could make the best use of new ball with his outswingers and then also use the old ball extremely well for reverse. Take him out from this attack and team loses that ability.

Imo It's Steyn vs Imran, the new ball bowlers are kind of set with SF Barnes and Curtly Ambrose, just my opinion Subs please don't yell at me

 

[kyear2]

But he is better, and easily so.

So why didn't the batsmen think so?

 

[Johan]

So why didn't the batsmen think so?

much slower, less flashy, less entertaining to watch, wasn't a psycho trying to hurt people or whatever bullshit that passed as macho back in the day.

 

[subshakerz]

So did Viv

Lol wait I thought it was a weakened side ala Imran?

 

[Randomfan]

Imo It's Steyn vs Imran, the new ball bowlers are kind of set with SF Barnes and Curtly Ambrose, just my opinion Subs please don't yell at me

I personally won't leave out IK and Steyn both. Both bring different things in team which no other player can bring. I don't think it should be IK vs Steyn.

 

[subshakerz]

Imo It's Steyn vs Imran, the new ball bowlers are kind of set with SF Barnes and Curtly Ambrose, just my opinion Subs please don't yell at me

I am rooting for Steyn because Imran in team 3 will make this exercise seem even more silly.

 

[Johan]

I am rooting for Steyn because Imran in team 3 will make this exercise seem even more silly.

Bruh

 

[subshakerz]

much slower, less flashy, less entertaining to watch, wasn't a psycho trying to hurt people or whatever bullshit that passed as macho back in the day.

Almost all the bats and bowlers of the rated Lillee better. Lillee coached Marshall and Imran on how to bowl the leg cutter.

 

[Johan]

Almost all the bats and bowlers of the rated Lillee better. Lillee coached Marshall and Imran on how to bowl the leg cutter.

Ok, who do you rate higher

 

[Johan]

I feel like the gaps between the batters are bigger and clearer than the gaps between bowlers

 

[subshakerz]

Ok, who do you rate higher

Hadlee because he was more proven, not more skilled.

 

[Coronis]

Think We will get Donald–Akram, Holding–Garner and Bumrah–Steyn before Lillee's name comes up, I think if PEWS and Coronis campaign well enough we can get Lindwall–Davidson too

Can’t speak for @Prince EWS but I don’t campaign for people like some seedy political supporter

 

[subshakerz]

I feel like the gaps between the batters are bigger and clearer than the gaps between bowlers

Very small gaps.

 

[Johan]

@Thala_0710 @capt_Luffy what's the count

 

[Thala_0710]

So far:
Barnes: 12
Imran: 8
Steyn: 13
Ambrose: 18
Lillee: 2
Bumrah: 1
Miller: 1
Akram: 1

 

[kyear2]

Whatever, all said and done, Hadlee was a better bat than Marshall and he would be replacing McGrath a bunny.

Just saying McGrath is better because of peer rating doesn't mean he wasn't incredibly close to McGrath as a bowler. You still seem unable to talk about skillsets.

Skill set and compatibility.

McGrath had an unmatched ability to target wickets with the new ball at the top of the innings. He also had the knack to dismiss the best batsmen from opposing teams.

His value per wicket is up there with the likes of Marshall, Ambrose and Davidson and his percentage of top order wickets taken is representative of that. He is very arguably the best new ball bowler in history.

He was able to sustain his success in the flat pitch era though his unmatched accuracy, subtle seam movement and ability to extract bounce from even benign wickets. He never stopped coming at batsmen, while Hadlee was known, like Ambrose to drop onto defensive mode when things weren't going to plan.

He played on flatter and less conducive wickets to Hadlee and had less access to the tail and to minnows, which Lillee maximized his output against.

With regards to this team in question, his bounce and seam stands in contract to Marshalls pace and swing, and his skiddy bounce vs McGrath's more steepling offerings.

Marshall and Garner were at their best when they also presented that combination to opposing batters and they tested differing aspects of the opposition's technique and will. McGrath was also more adept at bowling into the wind.

He had greater competition for wickets and still maintained an elite wpm and most importantly he was the vehicle that elevated a great team into one if the two greatest of all time.

He has the numbers, the skill set, the peer rating, the intangibles, the compatibility and tougher conditions.