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1st Test (Leeds) - 20th June

Nintendo

Cricketer Of The Year
I'm not sure why people invent meaningless metrics when they can just look at the scores. That tells you the Lords pitch was a joke. Any pitch that settles on the 3rd day was a lottery on the first two.
Huh? AFAIK seam movement is usually pitch dependent while swing isn't (overhead conditions, hardness of ball, other stuff I barely understand). If seam movement was lower than average on the first two days, and the scores are still far below the Lord's average, that seems to indicate the issue may not be with the pitch. You obviously need way more data (Hawkeye bounce on different lengths, dismissal types, etc) and human investigation/oversight.
 

Spark

Global Moderator
Huh? AFAIK seam movement is usually pitch dependent while swing isn't (overhead conditions, hardness of ball, other stuff I barely understand). If seam movement was lower than average on the first two days, and the scores are still far below the Lord's average, that seems to indicate the issue may not be with the pitch. You obviously need way more data (Hawkeye bounce on different lengths, dismissal types, etc) and human investigation/oversight.
There was a surprising amount of variable bounce on Day 1 which isn't ideal. Having said that, Smith showed that if you could bat properly, there was hardly anything unplayable about it.
 

the big bambino

Cricketer Of The Year
Huh? AFAIK seam movement is usually pitch dependent while swing isn't (overhead conditions, hardness of ball, other stuff I barely understand). If seam movement was lower than average on the first two days, and the scores are still far below the Lord's average, that seems to indicate the issue may not be with the pitch. You obviously need way more data (Hawkeye bounce on different lengths, dismissal types, etc) and human investigation/oversight.
Sometimes a pitch can seam too much whereas less seam may not be enough to beat the edges. I agree Smith batted well on it. But if your opinion is based on one innings of an ATG then I still retain some doubts about it.
 

Burgey

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There was a surprising amount of variable bounce on Day 1 which isn't ideal. Having said that, Smith showed that if you could bat properly, there was hardly anything unplayable about it.
Yeah I think that and how two paced it was made it iffy, rather than the sideways movement, which imo was fine. There were balls bouncing in front of the slips day one while others were coming through to the keepers shoulder height and at pace.
 

mackembhoy

International Regular
Harmison is often like this though. It’s not because he’s mates with Key.
True I'd had a few bevs and on bus back from town, but I don't think he'll ever be critical of this setup due to that.

Closest I've seen him get was the bemoaning all our injuries to our fast bowlers. Saying they are all breaking down due to the fact we wrap them up in cotton wool rather than them playing plenty of red ball.
 

wpdavid

Hall of Fame Member
Just have to hope it stays ideal batting conditions when England are in. Stokes trying to be too zany at the toss again.
360 for 3 doesn't exactly vindicate the decision, does it. Even if the weather holds, the pitch is going to be older and our batters will have spent a long time in the field while the weather is scorchio. It look like we really to need to make the second new ball count this morning, or we're in big trouble. Whether we have the bowlers to do that is another matter. I suspect we're in deep **** here.
 

wpdavid

Hall of Fame Member
Pope Innocuous gets through another over without a wicket.
I know conditions aren't exactly in Woakes' favour, but he's 36. I think it's easy to overlook that because of how long Jimmy lasted, and to forget that most quicks are retired by the age that Woakes is now. Not that the younger bowler is looking great so far; Pant doesn't seem to rate Carse at all. And he isn't actually that young anyway as he turns 30 next month.
 
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mackembhoy

International Regular
Hot day flat pitch, doesn't feel like England at all.
Mental that both sides wanted to bowl first on this.

Both got far too into the data about sides not batting first at Headingley and pitch remaining flat.

Rather than using common sense at this being one of the hottest June weeks in Leeds in donkeys and it going to be a belter from minute go.

Offering the other side the chance to score 400+ in first dig in the first test of 5 and put yourself under pressure is just daft.

Even worse from an England perspective with such a inexperienced bowling attack in Carse,Tongue and Bashir. Then undercooked in Woakes/Stokes.
 

cnerd123

likes this
Kuldeep plays for Jadeja or doesn't at all.
Same problem Ashwin had. We need Jadeja for his batting and we don't have a 4th seamer who can bat 7, therefore he was always made to sit out for a mediocre quick even if he would be a better performer. Happening to Kuldeep now, and he doesn't even have the batting that Ashwin did to make selecting him feasible
 

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