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*Official* Australia in India 2023

Shri

Mr. Glass
Kuldeep - bowling average 24 batting average 18-20
Axar - bowling average 24 batting average 30-35
Sundar - bowling average 28-30 batting average 35-40
kuldeep will average 15 at most with the bat
axar with the bat more like 25
sundar can easily average 45 if he takes his batting seriously.

sundar's rise in t20s as a bowler is similar to ashwin. new ball bowler who can strike at the top and given years of test experience in the future where he tunes his skills, you never know. he could end up averaging 25 with the ball.
 

social

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Yeah I meant he would get better in tests, but I rate Jadeja as high as Ashwin if not higher. His bowling cannot & will not be replaced. The corollary to that is the test batting standards are also going down further, the likes of SS/Root/KW & of course Kohli are last of their gen. Most if not all of them started their FC careers when IPL was not the biggest cricket tournament. The gen after them will struggle to last 3-4 days on even mildly helpful surfaces. This is why I'm partly intrigued as to how Bassball would work in India/Oz or other harsher conditions. Because the batters are assuming they'd probably not last a day or two batting on them. So how would that transform the 5 day game?
I watched the last NZ test & most of the English batters will not have a prayer if they bat that way in the Ashes

Might get away with backing away or charging once or twice but no way does it hold up for 5 tests

The Kiwi attack was predominantly inexperienced/not good enough & well below the standard of Australia, India and England’s own bowlers
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Washington Sundar is a huge downgrade over Ashwin as a spinner.
He's the second most Australian off spinner I've ever seen play international cricket after Will Somerville - and neither of them are actually Australian.

Seriously talented bat though. If he wants to forge a Test career he should try to do it as a batting allrounder IMO.
 

OverratedSanity

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I watched the last NZ test & most of the English batters will not have a prayer if they bat that way in the Ashes

Might get away with backing away or charging once or twice but no way does it hold up for 5 tests
They backed away mostly against Wagner. They generally just stand still and swing through the line.
 

Shri

Mr. Glass
post ashwin/jaddu/rohit/kohli retirement, we could go


Shaw
Agarwal
Shreyas
Gill
Sarfaraz
Pant
Sundar
Tilak
Kuldeep
Bumrah
Siraj

i don't know where to fit tilak in tbh. he is very composed and a good batter on par with sundar but axar should probably replace him. tilak is easily a top 6 batting allrounder
 

Sunil1z

International Regular
post ashwin/jaddu/rohit/kohli retirement, we could go


Shaw
Agarwal
Shreyas
Gill
Sarfaraz
Pant
Sundar
Tilak
Kuldeep
Bumrah
Siraj
I hope this is for Asian conditions. Because that top 3 would be regularly 30/3 in SENA countries
 

anil1405

International Captain
He's the second most Australian off spinner I've ever seen play international cricket after Will Somerville - and neither of them are actually Australian.

Seriously talented bat though. If he wants to forge a Test career he should try to do it as a batting allrounder IMO.
He showed great temperament at the big stage in Australia. Has the technique to be a good middle order bat (at no.5 or no.6). Has improved his attacking stroke play off late. All he needs to show is a consistently good temperament.

Can add good balance to the test team once Jaddu and Ash are done.
 

PaulLennon

U19 12th Man
27-28 averaging spinner is a massive downgrade over what Ashwin is producing over the last decade. Obviously the cricketer you describe is a cricketer most teams would kill to have, but the difference between a bloke taking wickets at 20 and one taking wickets at 27 is unquestionably enough to flip the result of Test matches.
27 overall. home avg of 23-24.

compared to ashs 24 and 20.

will compensate with batting.
 

R!TTER

First Class Debutant
kuldeep will average 15 at most with the bat
Depends on where he bats, he can easily avg 25+ in Asia, outside Asia I expect low single digits but he can definitely stay at the wicket in relatively benign conditions.
 

Nintendo

Cricketer Of The Year
I watched the last NZ test & most of the English batters will not have a prayer if they bat that way in the Ashes

Might get away with backing away or charging once or twice but no way does it hold up for 5 tests

The Kiwi attack was predominantly inexperienced/not good enough & well below the standard of Australia, India and England’s own bowlers
I mean they did the same thing vs on some green seamers with a proper duke's ball vs nortje-ngidi-rabada-jansen, managed it vs NZ with some variation of southee-boult-jamieson-henry and managed it vs an indian attack that had siraj-shami-bumrah-jadeja-shardul. It may not come off all the time, it didn't in one game vs SA, but it's not like it's just worked on pakistan roads and vs NZ second 11's.
 

R!TTER

First Class Debutant
managed it vs NZ with some variation of southee-boult-jamieson-henry and managed it vs an indian attack that had siraj-shami-bumrah-jadeja-shardul.
In the first 4 tests of the summer the balls were dog sh!t, in our test it was changed at least 10-12 times IIRC. In SA series they got a good batch but SA batting is even worse than Ireland over there!
 

anil1405

International Captain
Ashton Agar has been sent home by Australia.
Wonder why??
To play domestic cricket and apparently he will be back for ODIs.

That's probably the first I've ever heard of a touring player going back mid series to play domestic cricket.

Also number of players going back and forth mid series is staggering.
 

OverratedSanity

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That's not to say he's bad or anything but if you gave all Jadeja's overs to Axar in this series then he results could have been quite different. I haven't been impressed with him in very favourable conditions. I was looking forward to seeing him too, see if he could really live up to that hilarious career average he built by statpadding an absolutely dismal England side. Australia hasn't been much better and yet they've still looked infinitely more comfortable against him.
Obviously agree that Axar isn't as good as Jadeja and Ashwin. But I think he's been neutered a bit by Rohit not understanding how to exploit his strengths. Axar should have bowled early in the innings with the new-ish ball much more often than he has. He has the ability to get a fresher ball to skid very dangerously, but in this series he's usually brought in after every other bowler has already been given a long spell.
 

Nintendo

Cricketer Of The Year
In the first 4 tests of the summer the balls were dog sh!t, in our test it was changed at least 10-12 times IIRC. In SA series they got a good batch but SA batting is even worse than Ireland over there!
The ball was dog**** after 20 overs.*

Behaved perfectly normally initially, just got soft very quickly from memory. Was part of the reason sides where regularly going from 4-100/5-100 to 350+ AO.
 

Spark

Global Moderator
Obviously agree that Axar isn't as good as Jadeja and Ashwin. But I think he's been neutered a bit by Rohit not understanding how to exploit his strengths. Axar should have bowled early in the innings with the new-ish ball much more often than he has. He has the ability to get a fresher ball to skid very dangerously, but in this series he's usually brought in after every other bowler has already been given a long spell.
Bowling the donkey overs with the older ball is kind of the bread and butter of what makes a good spinner though.
 

CricAddict

Cricketer Of The Year
Agar getting released now is almost getting to the previous BG proportions in terms of injuries/releases.

Players missing tests for India in BG 2021: Agarwal, Rahul, Rohit, Kohli, Vihari, Ashwin, Jadeja, Shami, Umesh, Bumrah
Players missing tests for Australia in BG 2023: Warner, Green, Agar, Starc, Hazlewood

BG 2021 leads by 5 at the moment.
 

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