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Dale Steyn

Slifer

International Captain
Really?

Akram/Donald/Holding is better than Pollock/Walsh/Davidson. Quite clearly imo.
Yeah but if u were to replace any player in group one with another in group there wouldn't be any significant decrease in strength. Even statistically, there isn't much to chose between a Courtney Walsh and a Wasim Akram. I do acknowledge that Wasim was clearly better but the gap isn't huge. It's the same sort of gap that exists between a batsman like a Lara and an Ala Border.
 

social

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Steyn is the GOAT for me at the moment, that record in the subcontinent is enough to put him ahead of McGrath and Marshall. You have to admire Mcgrath's longevity and his total wickets though. If Steyn gets to 600 wickets with more or less the same average and strike rates then nobogy should questiin his GOAT status. For now maybe we should bite our time before anointing him.
If McGrath had played his home tests on SA pitches, his record would be insane

People tend to forget that he achieved his success in arguably the greatest era for batting in history and Oz pitches were as batter friendly as any
 

G.I.Joe

International Coach
That was very insensitive of you, Kirkut. These guys obviously have very busy and demanding jobs because they don't seem to have watched much of Steyn at all.
 

Hurricane

Hall of Fame Member
If McGrath had played his home tests on SA pitches, his record would be insane

People tend to forget that he achieved his success in arguably the greatest era for batting in history and Oz pitches were as batter friendly as any
dwta - this is mentioned a lot on cw
 

akilana

International 12th Man
If McGrath had played his home tests on SA pitches, his record would be insane

People tend to forget that he achieved his success in arguably the greatest era for batting in history and Oz pitches were as batter friendly as any
So Ponting's record would be a lot worse if he played half his matches in SA? By the same logic Amla, AB etc would average in 60s if they played home tests in Australia.

Anyways, McGrath's record in SA is not better than his record in Australia.
 

Dan

Hall of Fame Member
Yeah I think SA's pitches get overstated in terms of their friendliness to bowlers. Same as England's and New Zealand's tbh.
 

OverratedSanity

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Yeah I think SA's pitches get overstated in terms of their friendliness to bowlers. Same as England's and New Zealand's tbh.
Well, quality players like Amla, Smith and de Villiers all average in the low-mid 40s in SA. You'd expect such players to be more dominant in their own familiar conditions. Definitely seems to be a tough place to bat in.
 

Top_Cat

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Yeah, SA's always been a bit tougher overall. Guys from SA years ago like Kirsten, etc. always seems to average about 5 runs less overall than you'd think they would. Saw some decks in the 90's which were, frankly, not Test standard.
 

Cabinet96

Global Moderator
Yeah I think SA's pitches get overstated in terms of their friendliness to bowlers. Same as England's and New Zealand's tbh.
NZ and England are mostly roads but I do think the SA pitches offer quite a bit more. As OS and TC said, lots of their best players do much better overseas, whereas guys like Taylor, Root and Bell are dominate at home but have struggled away.

Lot of acronyms in there eh?
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
NZ and England are mostly roads but I do think the SA pitches offer quite a bit more. As OS and TC said, lots of their best players do much better overseas, whereas guys like Taylor, Root and Bell are dominate at home but have struggled away.

Lot of acronyms in there eh?
English pitches don't need to be bowler friendly tbf
 

Cabinet96

Global Moderator
English pitches don't need to be bowler friendly tbf
What because it swings and the Duke has a more prominent seam? I guess, but thinking about the games played in 2012 they weren't exactly prime conditions for whooping the ball around. Steyn bowled first change throughout that series as well.

Edit: Actually you were probably speaking more generally weren't you? Fair enough then I guess.
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
What because it swings and the Duke has a more prominent seam? I guess, but thinking about the games played in 2012 they weren't exactly prime conditions for whooping the ball around. Steyn bowled first change throughout that series as well.

Edit: Actually you were probably speaking more generally weren't you? Fair enough then I guess.
Yeah, just generally speaking

Greentops in a wet summer would see three day tests galore IMO
 

Burgey

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So Ponting's record would be a lot worse if he played half his matches in SA? By the same logic Amla, AB etc would average in 60s if they played home tests in Australia.

Anyways, McGrath's record in SA is not better than his record in Australia.
No, it doesn't follow at all. McGrath was a seam bowler, first and foremost he got wickets through movement (often subtle) off the seam, even on unhelpful pitches. When he got a really helpful pitch he was nigh unplayable. Some other blokes rely more on swing, out and out pace etc.
 

watson

Banned
No, it doesn't follow at all. McGrath was a seam bowler, first and foremost he got wickets through movement (often subtle) off the seam, even on unhelpful pitches. When he got a really helpful pitch he was nigh unplayable. Some other blokes rely more on swing, out and out pace etc.
Great bowlers like McGrath don't just rely on seam bowling, but rather have just about everything in their bag of tricks. Here McGrath sets up Ian Bell exquisitely with an inswinger so that that he is bowled next ball playing down the wrong line;


(I'm not disagreeing with your post btw, but rather adding some clarification)
 
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91Jmay

International Coach
The ball before was to Collingwood and the second ball seamed back which is what Burgey said McGrath did?
 

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