OK to taunt Murali says MacGill

[iamdavid]

The spectators owe decent behaviour towards sportsmen and if ppl can't see that, the problem is with them, not anyone else. Heck, people owe decent behaviour in public just because of the fact that they are human beings. It is called being civil and doing acceptable things in public. Otherwise, we will all be barbarians...

Think theres a difference between being barbarian and yelling "no ball" or "chucker" when someone from the opposition with a funny-looking (yes I know its legal but it looks fishy to all the Bob's and Robbo's out there) action bowls, and given that they are proffesional sportsmen and the spectators are paying to see them I think some tolerance has to be used.

 

[Athlai]

If the crowds were calling him "fat" or some random filth I think this wouldn't be an issue to him. The fact that this is all about Murali being a cheater is just what makes it so much worse.

When you call someone a cheater you question their whole right to play, their whole legacy and more. Accusations of cheating in games are as you should all know something people get rather emotional about.

I'm not saying we should take all taunting out of cricket, but this kind of behavior just isn't civil.

Acceptable: Can't catch chants at KP during ashes.

Unacceptable: This kind of crud.

 

[honestbharani]

That's, with all due respect, just not true.

How about the South African crowds taunting Adam Gilchrist about his wife etc.? I'd say Warne has probably endured the worst of it being such an enigmatic and huge personality. He cops it from every crowd in the world.

The best way to respond, is not to whinge about it, for that only incites crowds more, but to let your performance on the pitch do the talking. Murali hasn't done this in Australia as statistics show. Gilchrist shut up the crowd in South Africa with one of the finest double tons ever and Warne shut up the crowd...well, everywhere...with his brilliant bowling.

yep... his bowling in India and when he got smashed by Bangladesh was brilliant.... sure.


Leaving that aside, when the hell has Warne been called a cheat and that all his wickets should be counted out? when was his credibility as a bowler ever questioned? And abt the RSA thing, it was a one off w.r.t Gilchrist and the man said he was in tears because they were talking abt his wife and his friend Slater in that manner. Again, easy to be cool in a one-off.. Quite another to have taken it for so many years inspite having proven himself without a shadow of a doubt that he is not doing what he is alleged to be doing... In my time of watching cricket, I have never seen any player cop it as much as Murali and he went about it well enough for the first few years. Since then he has lost his cool a few times but it is perfectly understandable... I don't know in which world you live in because from what I have seen, Warne has never EVER taken anything remotely close to what Murali gets.... maybe he was booed in Sri Lanka but in India he has always had a royal reception (he gets the same from our batters, but that is beside the point ). Just watch the crowd reaction in Chennai when he broke the world record.... I wonder if we will get anything similar in Australia......

 

[honestbharani]

Think theres a difference between being barbarian and yelling "no ball" or "chucker" when someone from the opposition with a funny-looking (yes I know its legal but it looks fishy to all the Bob's and Robbo's out there) action bowls, and given that they are proffesional sportsmen and the spectators are paying to see them I think some tolerance has to be used.

tolerance varies from person to person and from culture to culture. So does the line between what is acceptable and what isn't. And it is not his fault that the Aussie spectators can't realize how sensitive an issue it is to a guy of that background and from that place.... He never instigated anything and he never said anything inflammatory in the first place. The Aussie crowds started it and they should be the ones to shut up.

 

[honestbharani]

And you think other cricketers don't endure what is technically 'slander'? Some of the things I've heard Indian players called at the cricket...sheesh. Goes further than slander. Not once have I seen them complain about it.

Juz because Indian players don't react to it doesn't mean it is any less inflammatory.

 

[honestbharani]

Bowling to someone in a vital part of a vital test is a bit different to sitting on the boundary waiting for a ball to come. His reaction to the Sarwan incident was very much "heat of the moment" kind of stuff.

and of course "heat of the moment" cannot happen when dealing with the crowds and giving them the finger, right?

 

[honestbharani]

Actually, Warne, although even liked in England, had been taunted about his divorce/weight/drug allegations throughout. Murali has only played 3 tests in Australia, how many has Warne in England?

The main difference being that Warne wouldn't react like Murali. As reported, he was crying in the dressing rooms when his marriage was falling apart but played arguably the greatest bowling performance in a test series.

The diff. being.. Warne did have problems with those issues... Murali is not a cheater...

And of course, just because Warne doesn't take it seriously doesn't mean Murali shouldn't too. As I said, ppl have diff. tolerance levels and it doesn't take away from the fact that what the crowds are saying are mean, vitriolic, malice-intended and basically inflammatory, esp. because it is not true..... At least, not true in the sense that every other bowler is chucking too and yet he is being singled out for the taunts... And his whole place in the game and his value are being questioned.

 

[iamdavid]

tolerance varies from person to person and from culture to culture. So does the line between what is acceptable and what isn't. And it is not his fault that the Aussie spectators can't realize how sensitive an issue it is to a guy of that background and from that place.... He never instigated anything and he never said anything inflammatory in the first place. The Aussie crowds started it and they should be the ones to shut up.

I understand that its a sensitive issue, but he is paid millions and he is adored and respected the world over, surely he is capable of simply rising above it. The more he reacts negatively and whinges to the media, the more Australian crowds will catch on and treat him badly.

 

[honestbharani]

So it's okay to abuse Australian players if they take it well but it's not okay to abuse Murali? That's nothing short of ridiculous.

Obviously racial abuse and so on is a totally different issue to Murali being called a chucker or people chanting "no ball" or whatever, and there's no point in treating them as the same. Murali should be able to come to Australia and play cricket without being racially abused, threatened or physically assaulted. However, here's no reason that he should be protected from being called a chucker, it's as simple as that.

where did anyone ever say it was OK to abuse Australian players?


All that was said was that just because they take it well doesn't mean everyone else should be expected to. That's all.....



And of course, there is no reason to protect Warney from being called whatever he was called as well and yet in India, you get evicted for just writing "Murali > Warne" when a match involving Australia is going on. It is obvious these things are viewed in a different way here in the subcontinent and Murali is not bound to take all these lying down. He can react as he sees fit and that is the end of that. The problem is with CA and their admins if they can't cut down these chants which are obviously false and which is hurting Murali emotionally. I don't know why England couldn't control the idiots who cried out stuff at Warney and as I said, just because they didn't do it doesn't mean it shouldn't be done anywhere. At the end of the day, ppl can only put up with so much. It is upto the authorities to make sure that the line is not crossed by the spectators when the players are trying to do their best to entertain them... Players are obligated to spectators sure, but they aren't obligated to take nonsense like this and turn the other cheek.... It is the stupidest argument I have ever heard, tbh.....

 

[honestbharani]

its ok for fans to taunt anyplayer why should murali be of exception

taunting is not the same as insulting, abusing and basically passing lies as facts.... baiting ppl is not on... not on CW and not in the real world...

 

[honestbharani]

Im pretty much completely in agreeance with MacGill here, what he said has been taken out of context a little but, all he actually meant was that it gets blown out of proportion and some players are overly sensitive to it.
The crowds are the reasons players earn these 6 and 7 figure sums, without public interest they would be nothing. Unfortunately in life some people arent as respectful as others and they might enjoy getting off their faces and yelling abuse at a player, deal with it, I'd gladly get sworn at and called names by drunk bogans for a million bucks a year as would anybody. Its part and parcel of being an international sportsman, and I know Murali may be more sensitive than others due to the nature of what he's had to go through to clear his action, but he knows its legal, the people who make the rules have deemed it so and the opposition know its legal, so who cares if the moron in row 32 thinks he's a chucker, harden up and play some cricket its what you're paid for.

nah... as I said, what is acceptable and what isn't differs from person to person and the only way to solve this is to set down some common minimum guidelines and I think if we ever do that (the ICC are not exactly renowned for being fast, esp. with Speed at the helm), I am sure that the whole "chucker, no ball" chant thing will be on the wrong side of the line and as such, no reason why Murali should put up with that nonsense...

 

[honestbharani]

I understand that its a sensitive issue, but he is paid millions and he is adored and respected the world over, surely he is capable of simply rising above it. The more he reacts negatively and whinges to the media, the more Australian crowds will catch on and treat him badly.

that I agree. I am sure he doesn't HAVE to react the way he does, which is what you and I think, Kazo, have been saying but it doesn't mean we should put him down for reacting the way he has deemed fit..... Which is what some blokes like sideshowtim are doing here.... Which is stupid to say the least...

 

[iamdavid]

nah... as I said, what is acceptable and what isn't differs from person to person and the only way to solve this is to set down some common minimum guidelines and I think if we ever do that (the ICC are not exactly renowned for being fast, esp. with Speed at the helm), I am sure that the whole "chucker, no ball" chant thing will be on the wrong side of the line and as such, no reason why Murali should put up with that nonsense...

What are they going to do to enforce it then?? Anybody who yells chucker is ejected from the ground ?? I think its a bit over the top, I mean if abusive language is being used and/or the law is being broken then thats fair enough to impose penalties on the offenders. But banning certain phrases or references to certain players is ridiculous

 

[honestbharani]

What are they going to do to enforce it then?? Anybody who yells chucker is ejected from the ground ?? I think its a bit over the top, I mean if abusive language is being used and/or the law is being broken then thats fair enough to impose penalties on the offenders. But banning certain phrases or references to certain players is ridiculous

I think it is ridiculous that u think it is ridiculous. It is an inflammatory comment and inflammatory comments have no place in spectator sports. End of story.

 

[Ikki]

The diff. being.. Warne did have problems with those issues... Murali is not a cheater...

And of course, just because Warne doesn't take it seriously doesn't mean Murali shouldn't too. As I said, ppl have diff. tolerance levels and it doesn't take away from the fact that what the crowds are saying are mean, vitriolic, malice-intended and basically inflammatory, esp. because it is not true..... At least, not true in the sense that every other bowler is chucking too and yet he is being singled out for the taunts... And his whole place in the game and his value are being questioned.

If anything, the fact that Warne did have those issues makes them even more sensitive. What's worse? People taunting you about your divorce or calling you a chucker?

And who said Warne doesn't take it seriously? I said he was found crying in the locker rooms, but his reaction was different and you yourself gave a great example (re. the Murali>Warne sign in the stands). Warne's dealing with it has been more beneficial to himself and less distracting, but they have definitely been serious taunts.

 

[archie mac]

The diff. being.. Warne did have problems with those issues... Murali is not a cheater...

.

The difference is Warne did his time, Murali is still 'bowling'

 

[Bracken]

"It's ok for spectators to yell out whatever they want, whenever they want and however they want no matter how insulting, disparaging or personal (AND OBVIOUSLY FALSE) the allegation may be...... The sportsmen should not even say a word abt it and just get on with it, says McGill...... And sideshowtim seems to agree......

The spectators owe decent behaviour towards sportsmen and if ppl can't see that, the problem is with them, not anyone else. Heck, people owe decent behaviour in public just because of the fact that they are human beings. It is called being civil and doing acceptable things in public. Otherwise, we will all be barbarians..."

Heh. "Barbarians". Someone's being a little bit over-dramatic, I would suggest...

"Leaving that aside, when the hell has Warne been called a cheat..."

By a hell of a lot of people. After the "John the Bookie" thing and the diuretic ban, for starters. I've seen people on this very board flatly accuse him of being a match-fixer and a steroid user, using those incidents as "proof". Are they barbarians too?

Come to think of it, judging by the joy you seem to get sliding in a few little digs at Warne's expense in this thread, maybe I should spend a little time looking through some past posts? You wouldn't have made such a false, baseless, "barbaric" claim in one of the ridiculously numerous Warne-Murali threads, would you?

Wouldn't it be funny if our holier-than-thou emperor here was actually butt-arsed naked?

"And abt the RSA thing, it was a one off w.r.t Gilchrist and the man said he was in tears because they were talking abt his wife and his friend Slater in that manner. Again, easy to be cool in a one-off. Quite another to have taken it for so many years inspite having proven himself without a shadow of a doubt that he is not doing what he is alleged to be doing"

So, "your wife is a wh..e and your child is a b..tard" is nothing compared to " you don't hurl a little ball in the way that the rules to a game say you should".

Really? You REALLY want to argue THAT point?

"I don't know in which world you live in because from what I have seen, Warne has never EVER taken anything remotely close to what Murali gets"

Now, going by the previous point, I would suggest that maybe you shouldn't be intimating that others are off the planet. You know, glass houses and all that?

Warne has been targeted by more invasive media attention than any other cricketer in history by a fair margin. Whether that is more or less than the guff that Murali has taken at the hands of a few stadia worth of cricket crowds and a dozen or so former players is debatable. It is certainly in the same ballpark.

"maybe he was booed in Sri Lanka"

Those BARBARIANS! Don't they know that they should be treating him with decency? They OWE him that. Can't someone PLEASE just think of the CHILDREN!

(Sorry- got a little carried away there...)

"Just watch the crowd reaction in Chennai when he broke the world record.... I wonder if we will get anything similar in Australia."

I would bet the farm that he would. Not a doubt in my mind. I'm sure you'll disagree. You'll be hideously wrong, but that doesn't seem to phase you a great deal.

"tolerance varies from person to person and from culture to culture. So does the line between what is acceptable and what isn't. And it is not his fault that the Aussie spectators can't realize how sensitive an issue it is to a guy of that background and from that place.... He never instigated anything and he never said anything inflammatory in the first place. The Aussie crowds started it and they should be the ones to shut up."

The "Aussie crowd" spend their hard earned money to finance the spectacle in front of them. They can cheer or boo whomever they please- the same as EVERY other crowd in the world. I have been watching cricket (as well as other professional sports) for 25 years now, and I haven't seen a team in the world that doesn't have to deal with hostile crowds at away games. Not one.

More to the point, there isn't a crowd in the world that doesn't save special treatment for certain opposition players when they visit. It is part of the spectacle of professional representative sports, and it happens everywhere. It is also entirely valid.

Funnily enough, the players that tend to get a special roast from the opposition crowd are often the players that the crowd most respects. Just like Botham in Australia, Warne in the UK etc.

As for what the "Aussie crowd should realise"- when in Rome...

"And of course, just because Warne doesn't take it seriously doesn't mean Murali shouldn't too."

Murali can deal with it however he sees fit.

If Murali is as distraught about the heckling he has received as some here are (and, frankly, I don't for one second think he expends as much time, energy and angst over this as some of the diehards here do, but that's a different story) then I would suggest he should find solace in the fact that the man who is universally liked, respected and admired has yet to be born.

A fact of life is that some won't admire you, no matter what you do. If that makes you somehow feel less worthy, then I would suggest that the issue is with you, rather than them.

"it doesn't take away from the fact that what the crowds are saying are mean, vitriolic, malice-intended and basically inflammatory"

Mean? Maybe. Boo hoo.

Vitriolic and malice-intended? Please...

Watch ANY instance of the crowd doing the "no-ball" schtick when Murali is bowling. You will see infinitely more smiling faces in the crowd than snarling. Whether you accept it or not, the crowd is giving Murali a roast- no more, no less.

"esp. because it is not true..... At least, not true in the sense that every other bowler is chucking too and yet he is being singled out for the taunts... And his whole place in the game and his value are being questioned."

There's that dramatic hyperbole again...

"It is obvious these things are viewed in a different way here in the subcontinent and Murali is not bound to take all these lying down. He can react as he sees fit and that is the end of that."

Yep. And others can make whatever comment about whether they agree with the way he handles the issue or not. And that is the end of that.

"The problem is with CA and their admins if they can't cut down these chants which are obviously false and which is hurting Murali emotionally."

Heh. "Hurting him emotionally". You should write for daytime soaps.

They haven't cut down on these chant because, just like EVERY other crowd in the world, they can make whatever comment on the game that they wish. When they slap their money down for a ticket, they buy that right, like it or not. More to the point, the performers on the field (that includes the umpires, by the way) SELL that right to the paying public.

"I don't know why England couldn't control the idiots who cried out stuff at Warney"

See above. There is absolutely no need to control them. Their actions are entirely valid.

"At the end of the day, ppl can only put up with so much. It is upto the authorities to make sure that the line is not crossed by the spectators when the players are trying to do their best to entertain them... Players are obligated to spectators sure, but they aren't obligated to take nonsense like this and turn the other cheek..."

Yes, they are. They are there to play cricket and the crowd is there to respond to what happens on the field. If Murali doesn't want to play in Australia because of it, that would be a crying shame, but is his choice. Once he takes his cut of the ticket price, he has to deal with whatever the response to his actions might be. That's how he earns his living.

If things get racial, then he has a point. Being taunted by the crowd for his action doesn't even go close.

"It is the stupidest argument I have ever heard, tbh..."

Oh- I've heard a stupider one. There was this one guy who said that having a whole crowd of people questioning the virtue of your wife and the legitimacy of your child was "easy to be cool" about.

Pretty stupid, eh?

"taunting is not the same as insulting, abusing and basically passing lies as facts.... baiting ppl is not on... not on CW and not in the real world..."

Ummm. Taunting IS baiting. They are the exact same thing. You make a disparaging comment in order to elicit a response. Both are perfectly acceptable.

"nah... as I said, what is acceptable and what isn't differs from person to person and the only way to solve this is to set down some common minimum guidelines"

They already have. Racial abuse is out, pretty much everything else is in.

"I am sure that the whole "chucker, no ball" chant thing will be on the wrong side of the line and as such, no reason why Murali should put up with that nonsense..."

If you think that ANY governing body is going to (or, for that matter, should) ban "no-ball" chants, you are deluded.

"I think it is ridiculous that u think it is ridiculous. It is an inflammatory comment and inflammatory comments have no place in spectator sports. End of story."

And I think it's ridiculous that you think it's ridiculous that he thinks ridiculous. So there.

Inflammatory comments from the crowd have been a part of professional sports for as long as they have existed, from every country at every level. Deal with it.

Sportsmen get to make a phenomenal living from playing a game that they enjoy. They make that living because people want to watch what they do, and react and comment according to what they feel. Part of being a professional is dealing with those reactions. To condemn MacGill for making that very point is beyond asinine.

 

[Richard]

Did you actually think about that argument before you typed it out? Do you really think Shane Warne gets called a fat **** because he "feels comfortable" with it and his close mates yelling from the boundary know that, or do you think Shane Warne chooses to take it as lightly as he can because he realises that's the best way to deal with idiots who call cricket players names?

I think if Murali's best mate called him a chucker as a light-hearted joke Murali would take it pretty well and laugh it off too. It's a bit different coming from Bay 13, just like for every other cricketer who cops it at the MCG.

I doubt it TBH, I think it's extremely unlikely any of Murali's mates ever touch on the issue.

Warne may or may not be the type who'd take being called a "fat ****" lightly. I know for certain there are guys I know who'd take it as nothing (at least, nothing more than being called "you dumbaess" or something less explicit).

I don't think Warne gets called such things for any reason other than that those are the first words that come to the minds of those simple fools who do the yelling. I thought it'd be fairly obvious I wasn't suggesting what you seemed to think I was. But Warne's reaction will naturally be coloured by his own expectations and standards.

 

[Richard]

It's ok for spectators to yell out whatever they want, whenever they want and however they want no matter how insulting, disparaging or personal (AND OBVIOUSLY FALSE) the allegation may be...... The sportsmen should not even say a word abt it and just get on with it, says McGill...... And sideshowtim seems to agree......



The spectators owe decent behaviour towards sportsmen and if ppl can't see that, the problem is with them, not anyone else. Heck, people owe decent behaviour in public just because of the fact that they are human beings. It is called being civil and doing acceptable things in public. Otherwise, we will all be barbarians...

funny to see a person who himself is whinging in that post calling another one a "whinger".......

yep... his bowling in India and when he got smashed by Bangladesh was brilliant.... sure.


Leaving that aside, when the hell has Warne been called a cheat and that all his wickets should be counted out? when was his credibility as a bowler ever questioned? And abt the RSA thing, it was a one off w.r.t Gilchrist and the man said he was in tears because they were talking abt his wife and his friend Slater in that manner. Again, easy to be cool in a one-off.. Quite another to have taken it for so many years inspite having proven himself without a shadow of a doubt that he is not doing what he is alleged to be doing... In my time of watching cricket, I have never seen any player cop it as much as Murali and he went about it well enough for the first few years. Since then he has lost his cool a few times but it is perfectly understandable... I don't know in which world you live in because from what I have seen, Warne has never EVER taken anything remotely close to what Murali gets.... maybe he was booed in Sri Lanka but in India he has always had a royal reception (he gets the same from our batters, but that is beside the point ). Just watch the crowd reaction in Chennai when he broke the world record.... I wonder if we will get anything similar in Australia......

tolerance varies from person to person and from culture to culture. So does the line between what is acceptable and what isn't. And it is not his fault that the Aussie spectators can't realize how sensitive an issue it is to a guy of that background and from that place.... He never instigated anything and he never said anything inflammatory in the first place. The Aussie crowds started it and they should be the ones to shut up.

Juz because Indian players don't react to it doesn't mean it is any less inflammatory.

and of course "heat of the moment" cannot happen when dealing with the crowds and giving them the finger, right?

The diff. being.. Warne did have problems with those issues... Murali is not a cheater...

And of course, just because Warne doesn't take it seriously doesn't mean Murali shouldn't too. As I said, ppl have diff. tolerance levels and it doesn't take away from the fact that what the crowds are saying are mean, vitriolic, malice-intended and basically inflammatory, esp. because it is not true..... At least, not true in the sense that every other bowler is chucking too and yet he is being singled out for the taunts... And his whole place in the game and his value are being questioned.

where did anyone ever say it was OK to abuse Australian players?


All that was said was that just because they take it well doesn't mean everyone else should be expected to. That's all.....



And of course, there is no reason to protect Warney from being called whatever he was called as well and yet in India, you get evicted for just writing "Murali > Warne" when a match involving Australia is going on. It is obvious these things are viewed in a different way here in the subcontinent and Murali is not bound to take all these lying down. He can react as he sees fit and that is the end of that. The problem is with CA and their admins if they can't cut down these chants which are obviously false and which is hurting Murali emotionally. I don't know why England couldn't control the idiots who cried out stuff at Warney and as I said, just because they didn't do it doesn't mean it shouldn't be done anywhere. At the end of the day, ppl can only put up with so much. It is upto the authorities to make sure that the line is not crossed by the spectators when the players are trying to do their best to entertain them... Players are obligated to spectators sure, but they aren't obligated to take nonsense like this and turn the other cheek.... It is the stupidest argument I have ever heard, tbh.....

taunting is not the same as insulting, abusing and basically passing lies as facts.... baiting ppl is not on... not on CW and not in the real world...

nah... as I said, what is acceptable and what isn't differs from person to person and the only way to solve this is to set down some common minimum guidelines and I think if we ever do that (the ICC are not exactly renowned for being fast, esp. with Speed at the helm), I am sure that the whole "chucker, no ball" chant thing will be on the wrong side of the line and as such, no reason why Murali should put up with that nonsense...

that I agree. I am sure he doesn't HAVE to react the way he does, which is what you and I think, Kazo, have been saying but it doesn't mean we should put him down for reacting the way he has deemed fit..... Which is what some blokes like sideshowtim are doing here.... Which is stupid to say the least...

I think it is ridiculous that u think it is ridiculous. It is an inflammatory comment and inflammatory comments have no place in spectator sports. End of story.

"It's ok for spectators to yell out whatever they want, whenever they want and however they want no matter how insulting, disparaging or personal (AND OBVIOUSLY FALSE) the allegation may be...... The sportsmen should not even say a word abt it and just get on with it, says McGill...... And sideshowtim seems to agree......

The spectators owe decent behaviour towards sportsmen and if ppl can't see that, the problem is with them, not anyone else. Heck, people owe decent behaviour in public just because of the fact that they are human beings. It is called being civil and doing acceptable things in public. Otherwise, we will all be barbarians..."

Heh. "Barbarians". Someone's being a little bit over-dramatic, I would suggest...

"Leaving that aside, when the hell has Warne been called a cheat..."

By a hell of a lot of people. After the "John the Bookie" thing and the diuretic ban, for starters. I've seen people on this very board flatly accuse him of being a match-fixer and a steroid user, using those incidents as "proof". Are they barbarians too?

Come to think of it, judging by the joy you seem to get sliding in a few little digs at Warne's expense in this thread, maybe I should spend a little time looking through some past posts? You wouldn't have made such a false, baseless, "barbaric" claim in one of the ridiculously numerous Warne-Murali threads, would you?

Wouldn't it be funny if our holier-than-thou emperor here was actually butt-arsed naked?

"And abt the RSA thing, it was a one off w.r.t Gilchrist and the man said he was in tears because they were talking abt his wife and his friend Slater in that manner. Again, easy to be cool in a one-off. Quite another to have taken it for so many years inspite having proven himself without a shadow of a doubt that he is not doing what he is alleged to be doing"

So, "your wife is a wh..e and your child is a b..tard" is nothing compared to " you don't hurl a little ball in the way that the rules to a game say you should".

Really? You REALLY want to argue THAT point?

"I don't know in which world you live in because from what I have seen, Warne has never EVER taken anything remotely close to what Murali gets"

Now, going by the previous point, I would suggest that maybe you shouldn't be intimating that others are off the planet. You know, glass houses and all that?

Warne has been targeted by more invasive media attention than any other cricketer in history by a fair margin. Whether that is more or less than the guff that Murali has taken at the hands of a few stadia worth of cricket crowds and a dozen or so former players is debatable. It is certainly in the same ballpark.

"maybe he was booed in Sri Lanka"

Those BARBARIANS! Don't they know that they should be treating him with decency? They OWE him that. Can't someone PLEASE just think of the CHILDREN!

(Sorry- got a little carried away there...)

"Just watch the crowd reaction in Chennai when he broke the world record.... I wonder if we will get anything similar in Australia."

I would bet the farm that he would. Not a doubt in my mind. I'm sure you'll disagree. You'll be hideously wrong, but that doesn't seem to phase you a great deal.

"tolerance varies from person to person and from culture to culture. So does the line between what is acceptable and what isn't. And it is not his fault that the Aussie spectators can't realize how sensitive an issue it is to a guy of that background and from that place.... He never instigated anything and he never said anything inflammatory in the first place. The Aussie crowds started it and they should be the ones to shut up."

The "Aussie crowd" spend their hard earned money to finance the spectacle in front of them. They can cheer or boo whomever they please- the same as EVERY other crowd in the world. I have been watching cricket (as well as other professional sports) for 25 years now, and I haven't seen a team in the world that doesn't have to deal with hostile crowds at away games. Not one.

More to the point, there isn't a crowd in the world that doesn't save special treatment for certain opposition players when they visit. It is part of the spectacle of professional representative sports, and it happens everywhere. It is also entirely valid.

Funnily enough, the players that tend to get a special roast from the opposition crowd are often the players that the crowd most respects. Just like Botham in Australia, Warne in the UK etc.

As for what the "Aussie crowd should realise"- when in Rome...

"And of course, just because Warne doesn't take it seriously doesn't mean Murali shouldn't too."

Murali can deal with it however he sees fit.

If Murali is as distraught about the heckling he has received as some here are (and, frankly, I don't for one second think he expends as much time, energy and angst over this as some of the diehards here do, but that's a different story) then I would suggest he should find solace in the fact that the man who is universally liked, respected and admired has yet to be born.

A fact of life is that some won't admire you, no matter what you do. If that makes you somehow feel less worthy, then I would suggest that the issue is with you, rather than them.

"it doesn't take away from the fact that what the crowds are saying are mean, vitriolic, malice-intended and basically inflammatory"

Mean? Maybe. Boo hoo.

Vitriolic and malice-intended? Please...

Watch ANY instance of the crowd doing the "no-ball" schtick when Murali is bowling. You will see infinitely more smiling faces in the crowd than snarling. Whether you accept it or not, the crowd is giving Murali a roast- no more, no less.

"esp. because it is not true..... At least, not true in the sense that every other bowler is chucking too and yet he is being singled out for the taunts... And his whole place in the game and his value are being questioned."

There's that dramatic hyperbole again...

"It is obvious these things are viewed in a different way here in the subcontinent and Murali is not bound to take all these lying down. He can react as he sees fit and that is the end of that."

Yep. And others can make whatever comment about whether they agree with the way he handles the issue or not. And that is the end of that.

"The problem is with CA and their admins if they can't cut down these chants which are obviously false and which is hurting Murali emotionally."

Heh. "Hurting him emotionally". You should write for daytime soaps.

They haven't cut down on these chant because, just like EVERY other crowd in the world, they can make whatever comment on the game that they wish. When they slap their money down for a ticket, they buy that right, like it or not. More to the point, the performers on the field (that includes the umpires, by the way) SELL that right to the paying public.

"I don't know why England couldn't control the idiots who cried out stuff at Warney"

See above. There is absolutely no need to control them. Their actions are entirely valid.

"At the end of the day, ppl can only put up with so much. It is upto the authorities to make sure that the line is not crossed by the spectators when the players are trying to do their best to entertain them... Players are obligated to spectators sure, but they aren't obligated to take nonsense like this and turn the other cheek..."

Yes, they are. They are there to play cricket and the crowd is there to respond to what happens on the field. If Murali doesn't want to play in Australia because of it, that would be a crying shame, but is his choice. Once he takes his cut of the ticket price, he has to deal with whatever the response to his actions might be. That's how he earns his living.

If things get racial, then he has a point. Being taunted by the crowd for his action doesn't even go close.

"It is the stupidest argument I have ever heard, tbh..."

Oh- I've heard a stupider one. There was this one guy who said that having a whole crowd of people questioning the virtue of your wife and the legitimacy of your child was "easy to be cool" about.

Pretty stupid, eh?

"taunting is not the same as insulting, abusing and basically passing lies as facts.... baiting ppl is not on... not on CW and not in the real world..."

Ummm. Taunting IS baiting. They are the exact same thing. You make a disparaging comment in order to elicit a response. Both are perfectly acceptable.

"nah... as I said, what is acceptable and what isn't differs from person to person and the only way to solve this is to set down some common minimum guidelines"

They already have. Racial abuse is out, pretty much everything else is in.

"I am sure that the whole "chucker, no ball" chant thing will be on the wrong side of the line and as such, no reason why Murali should put up with that nonsense..."

If you think that ANY governing body is going to (or, for that matter, should) ban "no-ball" chants, you are deluded.

"I think it is ridiculous that u think it is ridiculous. It is an inflammatory comment and inflammatory comments have no place in spectator sports. End of story."

And I think it's ridiculous that you think it's ridiculous that he thinks ridiculous. So there.

Inflammatory comments from the crowd have been a part of professional sports for as long as they have existed, from every country at every level. Deal with it.

Sportsmen get to make a phenomenal living from playing a game that they enjoy. They make that living because people want to watch what they do, and react and comment according to what they feel. Part of being a professional is dealing with those reactions. To condemn MacGill for making that very point is beyond asinine.

Another seriously impressive effort from hbh, and a perhaps even more remarkable one from Mr Bracken.

Seriously, tho, you seem to be painting hbh in a pretty poor light there really. I don't have the time currently to respond on such a large scale as this, but TBH I disagree with the general tune. hbh is a good guy, I don't know how much of his posting you've read (I've always presumed you read more than you post) and while I was told-off for saying "he's a good guy, you shouldn't say a word against him" regarding someone else a little while ago that's certainly not what I mean. I think you've possibly got the wrong end of two or three sticks TBH.

 

[Johnners]

^^^ Gun post from Bracken.