best captain

[G.I.Joe]

Wasn't it Keith Miller who asked his troops to 'scatter'?

 

[smash84]

not sure about that

 

[Dan]

Wasn't it Keith Miller who asked his troops to 'scatter'?

Yeah, pretty sure it was Miller. Despite that, sounds like he would have been a pretty decent captain.

 

[andmark]

ok, fair enough, he probably had the greatest side to effect on also..., just curious, on that one most important category, where would u rate imran khan??

I'd say Imran had a comparatively small effect on his side to be honest. Fair enough, he was one of the better/best bowlers of his time (some might say "at any time") but he too had a team of good individual players who were able to conduct themselves and their play well according to the situation. Overall though, I'd probably rank him amongst the top ten captains ever

 

[smash84]

I'd say Imran had a comparatively small effect on his side to be honest. Fair enough, he was one of the better/best bowlers of his time (some might say "at any time") but he too had a team of good individual players who were able to conduct themselves and their play well according to the situation. Overall though, I'd probably rank him amongst the top ten captains ever

As captain he also nurtured the talent playing under him

Probably the only good players he had in his team were Abdul Qadir, a young Wasim, and Miandad. Waqar came into the team during the last two years of his captaincy. And the time when Imran took over captaincy he had something like 5 or 6 ex-captains playing under him. In fact he himself had become captain in a player revolt so it wasn't that the team that he inherited was a close knit unit. The fact that after he left the team got better as far as individuals were concerned but the performance of the team suffered.

 

[GotSpin]

Bradman was not a good Captain in my opinion.Yes of the 24 Tests he Captained the aussies, he won over half of them BUT he had a brilliant team behind him. I saw him , as the ausies took to the field, turn to them and just say"Scatter". This is NOT good Captaincy,that is just having a champion team knowing what was required. Dexter was not unlike Benaud in his Captaincy style. He was a thinker and good tactician. He won close to a third of the tests he was Captain of England. You must remember that a "draw" was considered an honourable result when both these men plyed their art.

Was that actually Bradman?

You probably know better than me, but i always thought that Bradman strategically was quite a good captain

 

[sumantra]

As captain he also nurtured the talent playing under him

Probably the only good players he had in his team were Abdul Qadir, a young Wasim, and Miandad. Waqar came into the team during the last two years of his captaincy. And the time when Imran took over captaincy he had something like 5 or 6 ex-captains playing under him. In fact he himself had become captain in a player revolt so it wasn't that the team that he inherited was a close knit unit. The fact that after he left the team got better as far as individuals were concerned but the performance of the team suffered.

yes, true, i would always rate imran higher than clive (or for that matter, anyone i have seen)...but to be fair, clive lloyd didn't have a champion team either...i mean when he took over the captaincy, west indies was not an ATG side, which later, under his captaincy they became...

 

[JBMAC]

Wasn't it Keith Miller who asked his troops to 'scatter'?

Yeah, pretty sure it was Miller. Despite that, sounds like he would have been a pretty decent captain.

Keith Miller, to the shame of the ACB, never Captained Australia. He had certainly p****ed off someone in the uppers of that erstwhile organisation. Even his fast bowling partner, Ray Lindwall, got to Captain one Test in about 1957.
The only side Miller may be credited of leading is the AIF vs MCC in 1946 just at the end of WW2.
As to the quote "Scatter" it is one I have heard from Bradman

 

[G.I.Joe]

Keith Miller, to the shame of the ACB, never Captained Australia. He had certainly p****ed off someone in the uppers of that erstwhile organisation. Even his fast bowling partner, Ray Lindwall, got to Captain one Test in about 1957.
The only side Miller may be credited of leading is the AIF vs MCC in 1946 just at the end of WW2.
As to the quote "Scatter" it is one I have heard from Bradman

Nah, JBMAC, you must be mistaken on the "scatter" quote. Here's from Keith Miller's cricinfo page:

"But with Bradman by then firmly at the helm of the Australian Board, Miller never did captain Australia, although he was a born leader who impressed for New South Wales in the Sheffield Shield, and would have been a better bet than Ian Johnson, who was persuaded out of retirement when Lindsay Hassett stood down. Miller did have an unusual approach to captaincy, though: he sometimes set his field by telling the other players "scatter". On another occasion, having omitted to nominate a 12th man, he found himself with 12 players on the field. He observed: "Well, one of you had better bugger off.""

Keith Miller | Australia Cricket | Cricket Players and Officials | ESPN Cricinfo

From all I've read about Bradman, it doesn't seem to have been his style to ever approach field placements with a cavalier attitude as that.

 

[Spark]

Yeah that sort of blase attitude doesn't really fit in what I know about the man and his character either (which tbh wasn't exactly flawless)

 

[JBMAC]

Nah, JBMAC, you must be mistaken on the "scatter" quote. Here's from Keith Miller's cricinfo page:

"But with Bradman by then firmly at the helm of the Australian Board, Miller never did captain Australia, although he was a born leader who impressed for New South Wales in the Sheffield Shield, and would have been a better bet than Ian Johnson, who was persuaded out of retirement when Lindsay Hassett stood down. Miller did have an unusual approach to captaincy, though: he sometimes set his field by telling the other players "scatter". On another occasion, having omitted to nominate a 12th man, he found himself with 12 players on the field. He observed: "Well, one of you had better bugger off.""

Keith Miller | Australia Cricket | Cricket Players and Officials | ESPN Cricinfo

From all I've read about Bradman, it doesn't seem to have been his style to ever approach field placements with a cavalier attitude as that.

Put it down to "Pots and Pans" disease

 

[smash84]

yes, true, i would always rate imran higher than clive (or for that matter, anyone i have seen)...but to be fair, clive lloyd didn't have a champion team either...i mean when he took over the captaincy, west indies was not an ATG side, which later, under his captaincy they became...

Clive Lloyd was a good captain but it is very hard to deny the talent that he had at his disposal. I can't think of any other single captain in the history of the game who had players like Marshall, Roberts, Garner, Holding, Croft, Walsh, Richards, Greenidge, Haynes, Kallicharan, Gomes, and Clarke at his disposal.

 

[smash84]

btw MS Dhoni has been a VERY good captain. This past series aside (where it wasn't too much of his own fielding) he is right up there and arguably the finest Indian captain ever.

 

[sumantra]

btw MS Dhoni has been a VERY good captain. This past series aside (where it wasn't too much of his own fielding) he is right up there and arguably the finest Indian captain ever.

yes, it can be argued...dhoni has got the numbers to back him up...but the best indian captain since 1990 would be sourav ganguly for me, closely followed by anil kumble...

 

[sumantra]

Clive Lloyd was a good captain but it is very hard to deny the talent that he had at his disposal. I can't think of any other single captain in the history of the game who had players like Marshall, Roberts, Garner, Holding, Croft, Walsh, Richards, Greenidge, Haynes, Kallicharan, Gomes, and Clarke at his disposal.

yes, very true...just curious, did walsh play under clive llyod? don't think it will be a lot of matches though...(i am not trying to find a leak in your point, even without walsh that was probably the ideal team that a captain can hope for)...in fact, it's an important question, i mean, after all how much change can a captain make, and how far that old saying "a captain is as good as his side" can be applied...guess, there should be another thread for that one...

 

[fredfertang]

Clive Lloyd was a good captain but it is very hard to deny the talent that he had at his disposal. I can't think of any other single captain in the history of the game who had players like Marshall, Roberts, Garner, Holding, Croft, Walsh, Richards, Greenidge, Haynes, Kallicharan, Gomes, and Clarke at his disposal.

Agreed - in the early 80s Lloyd was captain of Lancashire for three seasons - not the strongest Lancashire side it has to be said, but they had some decent players - they remained mired in mediocrity throughout Clive's tenure

 

[Prince EWS]

Daemon

 

[G.I.Joe]

Daemon

 

[smash84]

yes, very true...just curious, did walsh play under clive llyod? don't think it will be a lot of matches though...(i am not trying to find a leak in your point, even without walsh that was probably the ideal team that a captain can hope for)...in fact, it's an important question, i mean, after all how much change can a captain make, and how far that old saying "a captain is as good as his side" can be applied...guess, there should be another thread for that one...

I know that Walsh did play at least one series under lloyd. Rob uploaded a video of that series but I don't think he played much under him.

Agreed - in the early 80s Lloyd was captain of Lancashire for three seasons - not the strongest Lancashire side it has to be said, but they had some decent players - they remained mired in mediocrity throughout Clive's tenure

btw did Imran captain Sussex? If yes, then how was he as Sussex captain?

Daemon