*Official* Road to the 2010/11 Ashes

[pup11]

Nah I don't agree with that. If a player immigrates to a country at a tender age, then takes up cricket, I don't see how you can argue he is anything other than a product of that country's system.

Yeah, don't have a problem with those sort of players, but England have lot of players who have learned their trade elsewhere, though as I said, it ain't a big deal.

 

[Spark]

Morgan is the most borderline IMO, since it wasn't very long ago at all that he was playing in the green.

 

[pup11]

Morgan is the most borderline IMO, since it wasn't very long ago at all that he was playing in the green.

Morgan, Ed Joyce, Kieswetter, Pietersen, Trott are some of the blokes who can't exactly be termed, as players moulded by the English system.
Poterfield and Rankin too, are soon likely to join that list.

 

[GIMH]

Just to clarify, you're cool supporting a nation you have no connection to, but have a problem with players playing for a country where one of their parents come from?

 

[four_or_six]

Morgan, Ed Joyce, Kieswetter, Pietersen, Trott are some of the blokes who can't exactly be termed, as players moulded by the English system.
Poterfield and Rankin too, are soon likely to join that list.

What on earth have Joyce, Kieswetter, Porterfield and Rankin got to do with the Ashes squad?

Morgan's obviously predominantly an Irish product, although he's been over in England playing cricket for years from what I read, and we all know he wants to play at the top level. KP, would never have played for South Africa, English cricket gave him a chance as an 18-year-old, nothing wrong with that.

Trott is the only one that I can see people getting slightly annoyed with.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Kieswetter is mentioned here but with any luck he'll never be picked for any England side again as Davies is a better keeper and bat anyway and i'd prefer Prior in the shorter game over bedwetter too.Hopefully Bairstow can improve his keeping too and become another option,beggars belief though that we went for the Saffer in the first place when we have a bloke like Foster constantly being overlooked.

Unless it was to stuff SA up when Boucher retires/is past it.

 

[grecian]

Kieswetter is mentioned here but with any luck he'll never be picked for any England side again as Davies is a better keeper and bat anyway and i'd prefer Prior in the shorter game over bedwetter too.Hopefully Bairstow can improve his keeping too and become another option,beggars belief though that we went for the Saffer in the first place when we have a bloke like Foster constantly being overlooked.

Unless it was to stuff SA up when Boucher retires/is past it.

bedwetter's not even the best 'keeper batsman at his county, let alone the country.

 

[zaremba]

No mention of "convicts" or "crims" this post?

Touche. Crim ****

 

[Teja.]

Just to clarify, you're cool supporting a nation you have no connection to, but have a problem with players playing for a country where one of their parents come from?

While I loathe the entire Saffer trolling and believe KP and Strauss are as much English cricketers as Anderson and Broad, I don't see what this has to do with anything.

 

[pup11]

Just to clarify, you're cool supporting a nation you have no connection to, but have a problem with players playing for a country where one of their parents come from?

As I said, I've no issues with anyone, playing for any nation, just stating that the the county structure, in England has failed to unearth good local players, don't know why anybody, should be so touchy about that!!

 

[Spark]

Decent bowlers, tbf

Swann is definitely a county product

 

[Prince EWS]

As I said, I've no issues with anyone, playing for any nation, just stating that the the county structure, in England has failed to unearth good local players, don't know why anybody, should be so touchy about that!!

The country structure has produced all of their current players barring arguably Trott, tbh, and you could make a case for him too. Even Morgan and Pietersen developed their games to a very large extent in county cricket. You can say that the junior and league cricket systems failed to develop as many players but everyone in the team has come through county cricket. It's not like England picked these players out of the Cobras team.

 

[zaremba]

As I said, I've no issues with anyone, playing for any nation, just stating that the the county structure, in England has failed to unearth good local players, don't know why anybody, should be so touchy about that!!

Not sure anyone's touchy about that really mate.

What I do wonder, though, is how a country which is "failing to unearth good local players" managed to win the Ashes. Of the 2 players involved in '09 who didn't learn their cricket in England, KP did bugger all before dropping out injured, and Trott played a lone Test due to injury.

Ah, but I'm forgetting those purveyors of series-winning spells, Eugene Terrebroad, Andre van Flinthoef and AB de Swanniers

 

[Jarquis]

As I said, I've no issues with anyone, playing for any nation, just stating that the the county structure, in England has failed to unearth good local players, don't know why anybody, should be so touchy about that!!

Because it's incorrect.

 

[four_or_six]

Ah, but I'm forgetting those purveyors of series-winning spells, Eugene Terrebroad, Andre van Flinthoef and AB de Swanniers

 

[pup11]

The country structure has produced all of their current players barring arguably Trott, tbh, and you could make a case for him too. Even Morgan and Pietersen developed their games to a very large extent in county cricket. You can say that the junior and league cricket systems failed to develop as many players but everyone in the team has come through county cricket. It's not like England picked these players out of the Cobras team.

There is nothing to suggest that KP or Trott, won't have turned the way they have, had they been playing provincial cricket in South Africa.
Anyways, my belief is that, there are way too many teams in the county structure, which dilutes the standard of cricket.
Its true that England, have some good players, but if the structure of the county circuit was more compact, a better pool of players could have been developed.
Same can also be said, about India's domestic structure, one of the reasons why Australia have always produced, numerous outstanding players is that, there is a simple, compact domestic structure in place, that encourages a more competitive environment, for the players to compete and develop their games in.

 

[Spark]

Injury? I thought Trott played because Bopara had beenn quite impossibly ****.

 

[zaremba]

Injury? I thought Trott played because Bopara had beenn quite impossibly ****.

Yeah you're right there. Zaremba talks ****, chapter 94

 

[Jono]

There is nothing to suggest that KP or Trott, won't have turned the way they have, had they been playing provincial cricket in South Africa.

That's not the point though.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Yeah. The fact that Strauss spent the first six years of his life in South Africa has absolutely nothing to do with how he's developed his cricket.

Actually I'm pretty sure I've read that Strauss played his first cricket in Oz, tbh. His family had 18 months in Melbourne after leaving SA.

Anyway, to my way of thinking our selectors only duty is to select the best XI to retain the Ashes, regardless of accents or upbringing. In fact if we didn't select the best available players because they failed some spurious "Englishness" test I think we'd be on very dodgy ground morally and potentially legally too.