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***Official*** South Africa in Australia 2012

howardj

howardj

International Coach
Looking back...

Can anybody believe we went into the "grand final" (Clarke's words) with a completely new pace attack

And that neither Siddle or Hilf could back up in the grand final (yet all fast bowlers of yesteryear have managed to)

And that Hastings opened the bowling (in the grand final)

I think they need to dust off the Argus review....the lunatics are back!
 
Top_Cat

Top_Cat

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Yeah the bowlers weren't the ones who got dudded for < 200 on a flat deck. Hilf and Siddle in the side would have made precisely zero difference, personally. They're no bowling genius'.
 
howardj

howardj

International Coach
Top_Cat said:
Yeah the bowlers weren't the ones who got dudded for < 200 on a flat deck. Hilf and Siddle in the side would have made precisely zero difference, personally. They're no bowling genius'.
Click to expand...
The game was gone when we were conceding SEVEN for the entire Day 3

Hilf and Siddle at least had control, and made us competitive

Again, it's the grand final, and Haystacks is opening the bowling?
 
NasserFan207

NasserFan207

International Vice-Captain
Reckon Siddle could've made a pretty big difference in the 2nd innings. Still think SA would've won though. And tbf we don't know how knackered he was? If he wasn't fit there's not much you can do

Hazlewood should've played though
 
Top_Cat

Top_Cat

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You've been bowled out for 200-odd on day 1 and your bowlers have provided a lead, deck is flat, the oppo's bowling unit has had less than a day's rest and you've got a side full of in-form bats. They had the initiative massively and neither of Siddle or Hilf would have stopped a big total, I'm sorry to say. You're over-blowing their (limited) influence massively.
 
NasserFan207

NasserFan207

International Vice-Captain
I agree TopCat, but I also think you are underestimating how ****e some of the bowling during that evening session was, and how down/flat the Aussie seamers looked. Mentally they looked shot, which is why I think Siddle would've made a difference. Also reckon with the length he bowls he'd have been a handful. If I remember right only two deliveries or something would've hit the stumps during that session
 
Top_Cat

Top_Cat

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Oh they were absolutely arse, no doubt. But so were the ****ers with the sticks in their hands who weren't good enough to handle Steyn and.....Petersen.

Mind you, I was predicting 3-0 SA this series so 1-0 and having the ascendency in Adelaide isn't too bad for this team. I just reckon we get stuck in the idea that the difference between this Aussie side being number 3/4 and number 1 is a matter of selection. It's not, the players available for selection just aren't as good as those playing for SA and England. Both of those sides have their weaknesses but they're still just better sides with better players.
 
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hendrix

hendrix

Hall of Fame Member
England aren't that great anymore.

When Anderson was about the most professional bowler in the world, they were top class.

He's lost the motivation now and I think England-Aus would be a fairly even contest.
 
Top_Cat

Top_Cat

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Closer in Australia than England but England still a couple of classes above with the bat. The thought of even a county trundler against Warner, Hussey and the like in swinging conditions fills me with dread.
 
P

Pothas

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
I expect Australia to win at least one test, and possibly quite convincingly as well but reasonably optimistic that England will take it 3-1 or something.
 
howardj

howardj

International Coach
Top_Cat said:
You've been bowled out for 200-odd on day 1 and your bowlers have provided a lead, deck is flat, the oppo's bowling unit has had less than a day's rest and you've got a side full of in-form bats. They had the initiative massively and neither of Siddle or Hilf would have stopped a big total, I'm sorry to say. You're over-blowing their (limited) influence massively.
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I was commenting on the bowling changes - and pitchforking Starc (a modest FC record), Johnson (not much form to speak of), and Haystacks (who actually opened the bowling) - remarking upon what a gamble it was for the grand final of Test matches. Nowhere did I say that the batsmen weren't culpable, or didn't have a huge part to play. I just remarked that resting Hilf and Siddle for the above was pretty mind blowing. Read Warne's comments as to what he thought of the bowling in the 2nd innings.
 
D

Dan

Hall of Fame Member
howardj said:
I was commenting on the bowling changes - and pitchforking Starc (a modest FC record), Johnson (not much form to speak of), and Haystacks (who actually opened the bowling) - remarking upon what a gamble it was for the grand final of Test matches. Nowhere did I say that the batsmen weren't culpable, or didn't have a huge part to play. I just remarked that resting Hilf and Siddle for the above was pretty mind blowing. Read Warne's comments as to what he thought of the bowling in the 2nd innings.
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Starc's the golden boy of the moment and was always going to get a go based on LO form, rightly or wrongly. He was, however, a better bet than Hilfenhaus in my opinion. Johnson came in on the back of his Perth reputation, which I can deal with (provided he doesn't play in Hobart. If he does...). Hastings, on the other hand, was a strange move. For all intents and purposes he had the figures to back him up, but it was an extremely longshot when all else is considered.

I would have asked Siddle to play alongside Starc and Johnson, if I were selecting. With Pattinson and Cummins both out, Johnson is the best bet in Perth. In Hobart, I'd probably play Starc, Siddle and Bird.

IMO the 3rd pacer needs to be 'horses-for-courses' to some extent. No point dragging MJ around the country when he can't bowl away from the WACA.
 
Justo

Justo

U19 Debutant
I'd keep Starc as well. Still bowled some peaches in the first innings and managed to come back well in the second innings(even if it was too late). He provides genuine striking power and I'd rather him over MJ.
 
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