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***Official***Match #35 - New Zealand vs Pakistan - November 4th - Bengaluru

Athlai

Not Terrible
While 200 (or 180) off 25 is obviously achievable if that’s what you’re set as a target, I feel like we might be overestimating how often a team reaches 180 or more for 1 off 25 in a 50 over match. Once you’re in that position 400+ is par. I daresay that much like 400+, a start like that is very rare.
Ehh

It was the Fakhar show. When Aussie lost Warner + Head they ended up not even reaching 400.

Powerplays can mean aggressive openers get off to genuine fliers, but its no guarantee that momentum continues throughout the innings.


Ultimately its fine. The **** part is that rain affected the match at all. Theres no major qualms with DLS giving it to Pakistan from the scores at the time
 

thierry henry

International Coach
Ehh

It was the Fakhar show. When Aussie lost Warner + Head they ended up not even reaching 400.

Powerplays can mean aggressive openers get off to genuine fliers, but its no guarantee that momentum continues throughout the innings.
Well yeah, but Australia still reached almost 400 and that was considered a relatively poor effort at capitalising on the start. And yeah aggressive openers can get off to a good start, but 200/1 off 25 is beyond that. It was pretty extraordinary, I'd be interested to know how many teams have been 200+ for 1 or less wickets in 25 overs in ODI history. I daresay it's very few, because even teams setting out to score 400+ don't typically need to score that quickly up front.

When you're prognosticating 200 runs ahead the alternative possible outcomes are more glaringly plausible and we were definitely robbed of an opportunity, but as a batting side from 200/1 off 25 you'd want a minimum 200 off the last 25.
 
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thierry henry

International Coach
tbf though chasing 400 and actually making a decent fist of it, even now, is such a rare scenario that there probably isn't solid data on how likely a chasing team is to win even if they absolutely crush it for 25 overs.

Still think Pak were clear winners based on any reasonable DLS assessment but that's probably straw manning since no-one strongly disagrees
 

DriveClub

International Regular
Yeah there's no guarantee pak would have chased 400 but since it rained they were in a good position. Luck is part of sports
 

The Hutt Rec

International Vice-Captain
I don’t really think you could have not given it to Pakistan in that position, but equally I think it was more likely than not NZ would have won from there if it went to 50 overs. All that hitting and they were only on par, lose a wicket or two, have a few quiet overs and the pressure builds very quickly.

So I’m just annoyed at the rain, really.
 

thierry henry

International Coach
I don’t really think you could have not given it to Pakistan in that position, but equally I think it was more likely than not NZ would have won from there if it went to 50 overs.
Because it's Pakistan (or this particular Pakistan team), sure. But if you think that the bowling team were more likely to win than the batting team in that situation generally, that should mean that they win on DLS, since the system is theoretically just spitting out the more likely outcome.

I really think we were gonna lose tbh but would've liked the chance to right the ship.
 

straw man

Hall of Fame Member
Can we please get our metaphors right? We surrender against our big brother, but we do disproportionally well against your big brother, who you melt against.

smh my head
 

trundler

Request Your Custom Title Now!
Can we please get our metaphors right? We surrender against our big brother, but we do disproportionally well against your big brother, who you melt against.

smh my head
All true but NZ also play like little brothers against us in WCs.
 

trundler

Request Your Custom Title Now!
You mean gain higher qualifications while our older brother becomes increasingly less relevant and wants to talk about the good ol days
No I mean the part where you keep losing, not getting jammily sneaking into semis because of rain once.

Cornered tigers ACTIVATED. Kiwis HUNTED.
 

ankitj

Hall of Fame Member
Some notes from watching the game at the KSCA. Was a good day at the cricket actually, very enthusiastic Bangalore crowd who showed up in decent numbers for a non-India game, and made a lot of appreciative noise for both sides. I don't believe that pitches like this one do the game any good though - I counted about four balls across innings which swung or moved off the seam. Couple that with the short boundaries, and the bowlers were never in the contest. Some highlights:

-- Lots of cheering for Rachin with some extra excitement over the fact that his parents are from here. If RCB have any sense they'd reel him in and capitalise on the Bangalore association (those who follow the IPL will know this is what RCB are least likely to do). Watching him live, it came to me that he's a reminder of early-days Yuvraj Singh in his ball striking, and how he wants to take the positive option practically every ball (which can also be his downfall)
-- By far the best part of the day was getting to watch Kane. Not the most challenging conditions to bat in but watching him unleash his full range of shots (especially the offside play and hitting the spinners over the top) was worth the price of admission, not sure if I'll get the opportunity to see him live again though one can hope; maybe when NZ visit in 2024. Again, the crowd showed their appreciation for his return and erupted when he took that running catch
-- Fakhar of course overshadowed both of them - very Gayle/Sehwag-esque innings in how he simply took the game away. His legside play was just breathtaking to watch, don't think NZ could have done anything much, even yorker length deliveries were being somehow savaged. I don't believe NZ had a sniff as long as he was there. I'd put this along with Fleming's 134* at the Wanderers in 2003 as one of the best WC chasing innings I've seen (that game too was decided by DLS)
-- Was accompanied by my cousin who's spent most of his life in the US, and knows enough about the game without following closely in recent times. Was a reminder of how distance and outsider perspectives can bring brutal honesty - this game was his first look at Ish Sodhi, and he declared him to be the worst bowler he'd ever seen! When Sodhi made a characteristic misfield at short fine leg, he wondered aloud what Sodhi was doing in this team, and I had to clarify no, Ish is a frontline bowler who's having one of his bad days! TBF as feared Sodhi was a sitting duck with those short boundaries against the left-hander
-- Both above cousin and another friend put it correctly when they said NZ barely seemed to break a sweat in reaching 400, it seemed too easy and almost low-intensity! Not entirely surprising how things turned out by the end.
-- Sparing a thought for Mohammad Wasim, who looked the only bowler on either side who worked out what length to bowl. Surprisingly slippery too. Pretty much every other bowler looked anodyne.

Despite the NZ loss, was an enjoyable day and didn't leave with a bad feeling. Knew all along NZ's bowling had íssues and this particular ground was always going to cause problems (could say the same about Pakistan really - happy for their lifeline, but don't believe either side deserves to go further than a semifinal spot with the way their bowling is). I just hope that losing after putting up 400 on the board leads to the some introspection from the core group - unwilling to mess with the formula and doing the same things again and expecting different results, a reboot is due after the world cup.
Which stand were you in mate? We were in C stand. Also, you are a visiting Kiwi?
 

Athlai

Not Terrible
Also I'd much prefer fight a cornered tiger than one actively hunting me. Its such a stupid saying

They're ****ing ambush hunters
 

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