Australia's second best Test fast bowler

[Flem274*]

I voted for Davidson because my mvp model indicates he edges it but on reflection I think it's Lindwall. His strike rate for his era is phenomenal.

All of Davo, Lindwall, Lillee and Cummins have very pretty averages in part because global bowling averages in general were lower than you'd think during their time, but they're unequivocally great bowlers.

I find them very hard to split so I'm rolling with the guy who has something that stands out and Lindwalls strike rate was phenomenal for his time, plus he has the best effective longevity.

Cummins will be the guy by the end of his career imo.

 

[shortpitched713]

Wasn’t aware that ambrose was in the running to be considered Australia’s second greatest ever fast bowler tbh

Well, no one knows **** about Lindwall or Davidson, so where the **** would you expect this discussion to go?

 

[shortpitched713]

Both of you then. Say "I will not deviate" 10 times.

 

[shortpitched713]

I voted for Davidson because my mvp model indicates he edges it but on reflection I think it's Lindwall. His strike rate for his era is phenomenal.

All of Davo, Lindwall, Lillee and Cummins have very pretty averages in part because global bowling averages in general were lower than you'd think during their time, but they're unequivocally great bowlers.

I find them very hard to split so I'm rolling with the guy who has something that stands out and Lindwalls strike rate was phenomenal for his time, plus he has the best effective longevity.

Cummins will be the guy by the end of his career imo.

So vote for him and join me, mate. Trundler and Patience are fine lads too. Associating with us won't get you roped into drafts, and other self-hating activities.

Trust.

 

[Coronis]

Well, no one knows **** about Lindwall or Davidson, so where the **** would you expect this discussion to go?

you =/= no one

 

[Slifer]

Wasn’t aware that ambrose was in the running to be considered Australia’s second greatest ever fast bowler tbh

Lol

 

[Slifer]

So anyway coming back to the topic, do you guys reckon Ambrose would be Australia's second best test fast bowler if he was actually an Aussie?

Lmao!!!

 

[Slifer]

Lillee is just behind Alderman and Murali as the best away bowler in Eng. Ambrose barely played in Pak or Sa or NZ. And wickets in WI were pace conducive at that time. And in Pak, where everyone took a truckload of wickets in that series, I don’t think it a great or even a good achievement for an ATG to come out with moderate success. I am not saying Lillee’s home away record is great, but Ambrose was tested more by a very small margin, while the adjusted WPM gap between both is atleast the same if not more. I understand your logic Subs, it’s just that for me very moderate success for one series in favourable conditions in SC or success on other pace conducive pitches doesn’t matter as much, as what is for me a sizeable difference in adjusted WPM. And this will be my last post about that on this thread.

Haha. Give Ambrose a few more tests in RSA or NZ and watch his stats improve for obvious reasons. Pak, he'd probably struggle however. Which is so odd seeing that Walsh was so outstanding in Pakistan and India for that matter.

 

[Godard]

Haha. Give Ambrose a few more tests in RSA or NZ and watch his stats improve for obvious reasons. Pak, he'd probably struggle however. Which is so odd seeing that Walsh was so outstanding in Pakistan and India for that matter.

Same with Lillee. He’d succeed there also. Was saying that comparing their records, when trying to prove Ambrose didn’t exactly master any conditions Lillee didn’t(WI was pretty pace friendly overall then, and Lillee did succeed their in WSC).

 

[subshakerz]

Same with Lillee. He’d succeed there also. Was saying that comparing their records.

Yeah Lillee with his cutters would likely adapt to SC.

Ambrose not so much.

 

[Godard]

I was saying adapt to South Africa and NZ tho.

 

[trundler]

Lindwall was the better Ashes bowler. Faced some pretty good batsmen too unlike the post War English attacks which sucked. Averaged the same as Davo after the same number of games too so they're effectively equals in my books. Both slightly lacking on longevity by modern standards but the War is to be blamed in Lindwall's case. There's really not much to split them on, even their Ashes averages are less than 2 runs apart, just that Lindwall was moderately more successful in England. This level of nitpicking is deep into samplesizelol areas though. Not really sure what to make of their work against India and Pakistan since they were the newest test nations at the time but still had some decent batsmen like Hanif and Hazare. Plus, Pakistan still had matting decks. Lindwall seems to have played more of England and WI for an equivalent record so I'm going with him. Also, I really like watching him bowl and I see him as the grand old man of modern pace bowling, regardless of whether that impression is true or not.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Yeah Lillee with his cutters would likely adapt to SC.

Ambrose not so much.

Ambrose was one of the absolute best ever at exploiting inconsistent bounce, so if he'd gotten a pitch or two like that on his tours here he'd have done well. It also depends on when he'd have toured. He'd have ripped India a new one if he came here in 1994 (iirc the Mohali pitch was very fast and bouncy and Patterson and Walsh had a field day).

In the second half of his career, his lack of penetration would've shown even more on some of those slower decks if he'd toured the subcontinent.

 

[Bolo.]

I voted for Davidson because my mvp model indicates he edges it but on reflection I think it's Lindwall. His strike rate for his era is phenomenal.

All of Davo, Lindwall, Lillee and Cummins have very pretty averages in part because global bowling averages in general were lower than you'd think during their time, but they're unequivocally great bowlers.

I find them very hard to split so I'm rolling with the guy who has something that stands out and Lindwalls strike rate was phenomenal for his time, plus he has the best effective longevity.

Cummins will be the guy by the end of his career imo.

It's basically the same as Davidson/Miller/Adcock, and much worse than Trueman

 

[Slifer]

Ambrose was one of the absolute best ever at exploiting inconsistent bounce, so if he'd gotten a pitch or two like that on his tours here he'd have done well. It also depends on when he'd have toured. He'd have ripped India a new one if he came here in 1994 (iirc the Mohali pitch was very fast and bouncy and Patterson and Walsh had a field day).

In the second half of his career, his lack of penetration would've shown even more on some of those slower decks if he'd toured the subcontinent.

Actually that was Kenny Benjamin.

 

[trundler]

It's basically the same as Davidson/Miller/Adcock, and much worse than Trueman

And Trueman's superiority is Rabada-esque rather than Steyn-esque imo.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Actually that was Kenny Benjamin.

Ah right. Beginning of the end of Kambli's career

 

[Bolo.]

And Trueman's superiority is Rabada-esque rather than Steyn-esque imo.

Eh, everyone strikes fast since Rabada's debut. Trueman is more in the Steyn class

 

[subshakerz]

Ambrose was one of the absolute best ever at exploiting inconsistent bounce, so if he'd gotten a pitch or two like that on his tours here he'd have done well. It also depends on when he'd have toured. He'd have ripped India a new one if he came here in 1994 (iirc the Mohali pitch was very fast and bouncy and Patterson and Walsh had a field day).

In the second half of his career, his lack of penetration would've shown even more on some of those slower decks if he'd toured the subcontinent.

That's exactly what happened when he toured Pakistan in 97.

 

[Ashes81]

Like all these type of discussions it very much depends on the parameters you're using.

Out of the Aussie bowlers I've seen, the best after McGrath were Tommo and Mitchell Johnson. However, they were at their peak for a very, very short space of time. Both were ferociously quick and aggressive bowlers who destroyed batting line ups.

Overall its hard to look past DK Lillee, after Michael Holding he had the best best action I've ever seen.

When he was young, he was genuinely fast and of course had that nasty streak all pace bowlers need.

As he got older, he dropped his pace and relied on seam movement but could still produce the old pace when necessary.

I think Cummings may surpass him but for now Dennis the Menace is the 2nd best Aussie bowler.l after McGrath.