All time ODI XI

[trundler]

Do you really think Lee > Garner
I can understand you didn’t pick McGrath as you had picked Pollock.

Or Bond or Donald or Ambrose or Waqar

 

[Gob]

Do you really think Lee > Garner
I can understand you didn’t pick McGrath as you had picked Pollock.

Not sure but regardless Brett Lee was a truly great OD bowler

My selection how ever was overall attack based. Wasim sort of get picked before any other pacer and I wanted an out an out quick and an economical fast bowlers to accompany him. So it was one of Pollock/McGrath/Garner and Lee/Bond/Waqar. Went with Pollock and Lee for additional batting and superior fielding all though I'm aware that Garner was a great gully fielder

 

[Red_Ink_Squid]

Anyone know how good Greg Chappell'was in ODIs to save me doing my own research? Stats wise his batting looks great for his era and he seems to have been the #1 ICC ranked all-rounder for much of that time. Could he split 5th bowler duties with e.g. Sanath?

Jayasuriya
Sachin
Viv
Kohli
Chappell
de Villiers
Dhoni
Pollock
Akram
Murali
Garner/McGrath

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

The perfect batsman for no.7 would be Klusener who had enough output at a good SR to finish off games as well as blast out a good score. But Klusener the bowler wasn't as good.

Kapil can blast out but with an average of 23 isn't ideal for a chase or if there is a collapse.

Imran is not as great a blaster but was more adaptable and more consistent. Imran was also the best bowler of all three.

Kapil and Klusner..not much difference in batting quality, Kapil averaged close to 30 in 80s. Klusner benefitted from shorter career and the era he played in.
Kapil was the highest ranked Indian batsman for half of the 80s.

 

[Godard]

Not a great analysis. You are confusing who may be more suitable at no.7 in an ATG XI with who was a better all-rounder.

Imran Khan was objectively a better all-rounder than Kapil Dev in ODIs.

Imran and Kapil both started as tailenders, yet Imran progressed enough in his batting to bat in the top 4/5 whereas Kapil was never that good. Imran has a 10 point average advantage over Kapil which basically means he is a league ahead as a bat. It is strange that you can brush aside the fact that Imran can average 38 in the top 5 while comparing him to a lower order bat who averages 23, and then suggest the latter is a better bat!

Imran in the 1980s was one of the best ODI bowlers in the world WHILE averaging 33 with the bat. Kapil never reached that level.

Kapil's only advantage is fielding.

Again, you may think Kapil is more suitable at no.7 given the depth of the ATG XI batting, which is fine, but as a ODI player Imran was simply superior.

I don’t know how many Imran is better bowler than Kapil, if their overall career stats are similar, just that Kapil took more wickets. At their peaks, Imran took 149 wickets@23(79-89) and Kapil 186 wickets@24(from 83-91). For so much time you have been stating that Imran was one of the best ODI bowlers in the 80s, but Kapil was a league behind Imran at his peak, whereas I have quoted peak stats and proven my statement. Imran was a more adaptable batsmen, sure, but as a lower order batsmen Kapil was clearly better. Both average sub 30 at 6 and below. It’s just that Kapil had a much higher strike rate. Also while Kapil was never mature enough to bat in the top 5, but Imran at 5 may have been better than Kapil at such a position, but he didn’t bring a new approach at that position as Kapil did at his. Kapil is clearly a superior ODI player, as I’ve shown at 7, there are only 6 or so people who average above 30 at the position. And how can you assume, if Imran averaged 38 at 5, he would play like that at 6 or 7, when he clearly averaged sub 30(only a little above Kapil at that position) when he did play there.

 

[Godard]

Also Imran averaged 38 at that position at a not at all ATG SR. Maybe Kapil wasn’t mature enough to slow down to play like that at that position, but u make it look Imran was as good as Kapil at 7 or 8, and also brilliant at 5 also as a reliable batsmen, whereas he might have been decent at 5 for that era with that SR, but he wasn’t a great ODI bat at 5 by any means. What I have said is that Kapil is better bat than Imran at 7, not inside the top 5(where a bowling all rounder is not going to bat) more suitable as a bowling all rounder in an all time XI. Kapil at 7 or 8 averaging 25 at SR of 95, would be quite valuable as lower middle order batsmen, consistent in playing good cameos and providing strong finishes(like he did in the 1992 WC). Imran wouldnt be that valuable at 7, averaging 33(still sub 35, not so reliable, that we can take his slow SR) at an SR of 73. Also you earlier said Imran knew when to accelerate by providing his SR at 7, while being a reliable batsmen(to prove which you would need his stats at 5)which makes it seems like he was simultaneously batting at 5 and 7. He batted at 6 and 7 at an early stage, and later became a slower, more reliable middle order batsmen.

 

[Godard]

there weren’t and aren’t many ODI players in the lower middle order or at all who bat@ an SR of 95. There are many players who can average 38@5

 

[Godard]

Kapil was revolutionary in his approach to the game with his batting. Imran more adaptable, but never a batting match winner at any position. I rate Kapil as more revolutionary in his approach, not as better batsmen. Imran and Kapil were better than each other at different roles. Imran was decent at two roles, Kapil was great at one, an approach he continued well late into his career.

 

[Godard]

175(138), 72(58), 89(63), 64(54), 58(31), 54(41), 72(38), 60(37), 75(51). Kapil was far ahead in his approach of his time.

 

[Sunil1z]

Please stop . Give this topic a rest.

 

[Adorable Asshole]

Bevan was the original Dhoni in 90s. Watch these 2 matches and then tell whether your opinion has changed.

The first match had pretty **** bowling attack. The second innings was pretty good tho but he got lucky with a drop catch.

He was good in crisis situation but couldn't hit from ball 1 which is th ability needed at 6 or 7.

I won't trust Beavan if i needed 95 from 10 overs and he has just come to crease. I would rather trust Klusener, Symonds or even Kapil

 

[Godard]

Please stop . Give this topic a rest.

I don’t have a problem with people thinking Imran is a superior ODI player, but I just want to make sure that my analysis is clearly understood. Also it annoys me when someone states Imran is objectively superior. It’s not that clear.

 

[trundler]

I see you've met good old Subshakerz for the first time.

 

[Sunil1z]

I don’t have a problem with people thinking Imran is a superior ODI player, but I just want to make sure that my analysis is clearly understood. Also it annoys me when someone states Imran is objectively superior. It’s not that clear.

There is a edit button on your post . Try to use it and don’t make back to back post 4 times

 

[Bitmap]

Sachin
Jayasuriya
V Richards
Kohli
de Villiers
Dhoni+ (C)
Klusener
Wasim
Garner
Murali
McGrath

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Anyone know how good Greg Chappell'was in ODIs to save me doing my own research? Stats wise his batting looks great for his era and he seems to have been the #1 ICC ranked all-rounder for much of that time. Could he split 5th bowler duties with e.g. Sanath?

Jayasuriya
Sachin
Viv
Kohli
Chappell
de Villiers
Dhoni
Pollock
Akram
Murali
Garner/McGrath

Plus Viv and Sachin. Plenty of bowling.

 

[trundler]

Plus Viv and Sachin. Plenty of bowling.

The way I see it Klusener would be at their level in an all time context and these guys would just get murdered.

 

[ankitj]

So now there is not much difference between Kapil who averaged 23 and Klusener who averaged 40+?

 

[Adorable Asshole]

So now there is not much difference between Kapil who averaged 23 and Klusener who averaged 40+?

Are u referencing me?

No Klusener is a better bat than Kapil but that's not my point. I would pick Kapil over Bevan if i needed 95 from 60 and they are new to the crease in an ATXI situation fcing Garner, Mcgrath, Warne

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

So now there is not much difference between Kapil who averaged 23 and Klusener who averaged 40+?

Klusner played for 9 years
Kapil averaged 28 at 105 for a similar stretch. If you convert that to Klusner era, it would be around 31 at 130.

Also if you compare 28 at 105 with specialist batsmen of 1980s..
Kapil is better than the likes of Border, Azhar, Ranatunga, Gower, Srikanth, Desilva.. Etc