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Is Dhoni greatest OdI cricketer off all-time

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It's been comprehensively shown on this forum by myself that Symonds is a very adequate 5th bowling option.

I wouldn't have him as sole fifth option in a fantasy ATG thing, but in a run of the mill ODI he's fine with the ball.
 
stephen

stephen

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
trundler said:
His bowling is lesser than Jayasuriya-level which is where I draw the line in an AT context and as a #5 he's a downgrade over De Villiers. Not really a #7. Rather have Hussey because Symonds's bowling is a non factor imo.
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If you're looking for someone to bowl 4 overs per match (remembering you also have Viv and Tendulkar), be a great lower orders slogger and be a constant presence in the field then Symonds is your man. He absolutely belongs there - he's a better batsman than the others and gives you a third bowling option to full in the extra ten overs.
 
C

cricketsavant

U19 12th Man
Does Dhoni get into an ODI all time XI hands down?

He has very sharp competition from Gilly, who most would rank as superior ODI keeper batsman . Certainly a most destructive batsman.

Dhoni is a great player but far far from greatest ever ODI player.
 
trundler

trundler

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stephen said:
If you're looking for someone to bowl 4 overs per match (remembering you also have Viv and Tendulkar), be a great lower orders slogger and be a constant presence in the field then Symonds is your man. He absolutely belongs there - he's a better batsman than the others and gives you a third bowling option to full in the extra ten overs.
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Problem is that 6-7 is such a niche role because no team will bat their best player there. So you'll have to take a punt by either batting someone too high or too low. Klusener stands out in this regard which is why he's my #7
 
honestbharani

honestbharani

Whatever it takes!!!
Symonds as a batsman is of no value outside of #5. As a bowler, he is not good enough to be a proper 5th bowler. I have made this point elsewhere but to me, he is nowhere near the ATG ODI XI and is in the conversation for the second XI but still won't make mine.

And Gilly over MSD in ODIs is just laughable.
 
harsh.ag

harsh.ag

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It's tough to understand why stephen wants to have the same conversation over and over again. Just say, I have a personal preference for Symonds that is above and beyond others have, and not try to make it out to be a normal thing that shouldn't be controversial.
 
C

cricketsavant

U19 12th Man
honestbharani said:
Symonds as a batsman is of no value outside of #5. As a bowler, he is not good enough to be a proper 5th bowler. I have made this point elsewhere but to me, he is nowhere near the ATG ODI XI and is in the conversation for the second XI but still won't make mine.

And Gilly over MSD in ODIs is just laughable.
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Why is it laughable? Gilly was one of the most destructive ODI batsman in the greatest ODI team of all time. Maybe laughable if you have certain biases. He was also a better keeper for a longer period of time. Dhoni spent almost a decade as a podgy backstop he got annoyed with journalists questioning his fitness (it did improve at times but I don't think he kept the diet of an athlete).
 
stephen

stephen

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honestbharani said:
Symonds as a batsman is of no value outside of #5. As a bowler, he is not good enough to be a proper 5th bowler. I have made this point elsewhere but to me, he is nowhere near the ATG ODI XI and is in the conversation for the second XI but still won't make mine.

And Gilly over MSD in ODIs is just laughable.
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Your second paragraph actually demonstrates why your first paragraph is not just your opinion but is likely heavily flawed.

And I didn't even say that Symonds was the definitive choice for that spot, I said that he was one of four very good options for that spot. Whichever one of those options you take depends on the things you value in a player.

I hope you realise that saying Symonds has "no value" outside number 5 is completely insane.
 
honestbharani

honestbharani

Whatever it takes!!!
cricketsavant said:
Why is it laughable? Gilly was one of the most destructive ODI batsman in the greatest ODI team of all time. Maybe laughable if you have certain biases. He was also a better keeper for a longer period of time. Dhoni spent almost a decade as a podgy backstop he got annoyed with journalists questioning his fitness (it did improve at times but I don't think he kept the diet of an athlete).
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:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Well, we have some brilliant arguments here. Gilly being the better gloveman over MSD is absurd to the extreme and what you expect of an one eyed India-bashing Paks supporter who is also pissed off by his side currently being crap. I mean, if you hate MSD so much, it explains why you are hardly ever around here to post, as there is only so much salt a human body can take. :laugh:


stephen said:
Your second paragraph actually demonstrates why your first paragraph is not just your opinion but is likely heavily flawed.

And I didn't even say that Symonds was the definitive choice for that spot, I said that he was one of four very good options for that spot. Whichever one of those options you take depends on the things you value in a player.

I hope you realise that saying Symonds has "no value" outside number 5 is completely insane.
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And Symonds' record has been done to death in the other thread, @stephen but of course, can't let facts get in the way of stupid accusations of bias towards a poster coz if someone ever points out the fact that you are overrating an Aussie cricketer, which is basically all you do, of course it is heavily flawed. :laugh:

I hope you realize that saying anyone's opinion "is heavily flawed" is basically pot.kettle.black.
 
OverratedSanity

OverratedSanity

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srbhkshk said:
WTF? He had his back issues like most keepers do, but fitness wasn't what you would question the guy at.
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Yeah pretty silly post. Dhoni has his faults but he was an insanely fast runner between the wickets even after keeping for 50 overs and never looked like he got exhausted. Being supremely fit is probably one of his best attributes.
 
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