ODI Debut Chronology draft

[trundler]

Jason Roy (2105-05-08)

Lamb >>>>>>>> Roussow and similarly Vaas >>>> guys like Ntini and Johnson. Think a leftover XI will be quite good this time.

 

[Pothas]

Lamb >>>>>>>> Roussow and similarly Vaas >>>> guys like Ntini and Johnson. Think a leftover XI will be quite good this time.

I fully intended to pick Vaas but then to my surprise Kallis was still available, I should probably still have picked him. That era around Vaas was the strongest of the whole draft which is probably why he didn't get picked. Ntini and Johnson are pretty excellent as my 3rd and 4th best bowlers though, batting is definitely my weaker area.

 

[honestbharani]

Lockie Ferguson doesn't have the likes of Alec Stewart overhyping but he's been very bit as good as Archer

Yeah but I don't see him as a new ball bowler.. I wanted a new ball bowler and so Ngidi seemed a better choice. And he has shown how good he is at the death too.

 

[Pothas]

Saeed Anwar
Jason Roy
Jacques Kallis
Aravinda de Silva
Yuvraj Singh
Jos Buttler
Kedhar Jadhav
Mitchell Johnson
Joel Garner
Makhaya Ntini
Muttiah Muralitharan

Pretty good. Bowling the obvious strength with arguably the best ever fast bowler and the best ever spinner. Kallis strong enough as a 5th bowler on his own but also 3 part time spin options. Batting would certainly be great to watch, Kallis to do the holding role with everyone else having a superb strike rate for their era, some of the very best World Cup performers in there as well.

 

[honestbharani]

Jadhav Johnson and Ntini bring the side down a notch. Otherwise, top drawer.

 

[stephen]

Kallis sticks out like dogs balls in that lineup. The rest are fluent strike makers. He's a plodder.

 

[Pothas]

Well I probably needed one. Also has a better strike rate than Chanderpaul....

 

[stephen]

Well I probably needed one. Also has a better strike rate than Chanderpaul....

Chanderpaul has the strike rate he does because it was him (and Lara) or nothing. Kallis played alongside some extremely good players and sucked momentum out of the innings when he came to the crease. Don't get me wrong, he is the most valuable test cricketer in my lifetime but in ODIs he really wasn't great. Although Dippenaar made him look like a dasher so there's that.

 

[ankitj]

Don't think in his playing days, Kallis was being marked down in ODIs. He was still one of the main wickets for opposition in shorter format.

 

[honestbharani]

Also played a crucial role in RSA winning their only ICC trophy so far.

 

[stephen]

Don't think in his playing days, Kallis was being marked down in ODIs. He was still one of the main wickets for opposition in shorter format.

Really? I remember a lot of talk in the media about his slow strike rate. I definitely remember his momentum sucking innings in the 2007 world cup against Australia. Watson should probably get the credit for his insane runout of de Villiers, but Kallis coming to the crease removed all doubts about who was going to win.

 

[stephen]

Don't take this as me having a go at your team Pothas, because it's a good side and every side can afford one or even two slower batsmen.

 

[trundler]

It's insane how much the game has changed. The type of game Anwar and Tendulkar had is now the token anchor role and no team can have more than 1 or 2 of those. Even a guy like Gayle who starts a bit slow but then catches up later can cost you valuable runs.

 

[ankitj]

Really? I remember a lot of talk in the media about his slow strike rate. I definitely remember his momentum sucking innings in the 2007 world cup against Australia. Watson should probably get the credit for his insane runout of de Villiers, but Kallis coming to the crease removed all doubts about who was going to win.

Sometimes I feel you don't really watch non Aussie cricket. Kallis won't be useful when chasing 375 but in vast majority of games he was super useful. How do you think he won 32 player of the match awards, same number as Ponting but in fewer games?

 

[weldone]

Even a guy like Gayle who starts a bit slow but then catches up later can cost you valuable runs.

only if he gets out before accelerating

 

[ankitj]

It's insane how much the game has changed. The type of game Anwar and Tendulkar had is now the token anchor role and no team can have more than 1 or 2 of those. Even a guy like Gayle who starts a bit slow but then catches up later can cost you valuable runs.

Check era adjusted SRs in the other thread. Tendulkar is among the fastest scorers. For comparison, Tendulkar has better career SR than Ross Taylor even without era adjustment.

 

[Pothas]

It's insane how much the game has changed. The type of game Anwar and Tendulkar had is now the token anchor role and no team can have more than 1 or 2 of those. Even a guy like Gayle who starts a bit slow but then catches up later can cost you valuable runs.

Yep it is especially striking in that number 3 role that Kallis used to play, we sort of take it for granted now that players like Root and Williamson can average around 50 and score at not much worse than a run a ball. That player even 10 years ago looks like one of the best ODI bats of all time.

 

[stephen]

Sometimes I feel you don't really watch non Aussie cricket. Kallis won't be useful when chasing 375 but in vast majority of games he was super useful. How do you think he won 32 player of the match awards, same number as Ponting but in fewer games?

And yet Australia is the country with the lowest average strike rate (on the main grounds). Kallis was good, I'll grant you that. But he wasn't great in ODIs. You will struggle to find anyone other than Dippenaar who had a lower strike rate post 2000. His bowling was extremely valuable to South Africa though and there probably wasn't any better batsmen waiting in the wings to replace him either. To be fair to him his strike rate did improve across his career as opposed to Chanderpaul who stayed at the same pace most of the time.

 

[stephen]

Check era adjusted SRs in the other thread. Tendulkar is among the fastest scorers. For comparison, Tendulkar has better career SR than Ross Taylor even without era adjustment.

What was Kallis and Chanderpaul's adjusted strike rate?

 

[ankitj]

On SR alone, Kallis scored at 0.95 times benchmark SR, Chanderpaul at 0.94.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Dzzge9SGNJ0kctoKLeYG5xDf5bJgK0nqvzwFU1dM0fE/