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*Official* English Football Season 2010-11

vcs

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Goal aside he was completely anonymous. Was a top finish mind.

Not sure what a difference Scholes would have made. He was made to look old and finished in the 2009 final, as was Giggs. Both men can still do a job (unlike Carrick) in the EPL but games like this are well beyond them now. Vidic was immense. Not been a good week for Vidic, on the wrong end of hiding last night and Ratko Mladic is going to The Hague.
Probably not much, but might have made it slightly harder for Barca's midfield to run circles around United. Also, when you have the ball for such brief periods, you have to use it very effectively and Scholes is a great passer and switches play very well. Mind you, I doubt Busquets and co. would have given him much space and time to do his thing, but at least it would have made the midfield a bit congested.

As it was, Carrick and Giggs were invisible. Valencia ran around fouling people. Park ran around. Man United offered virtually no threat for the brief periods when they had the ball because they were far too impatient to get rid of it, Scholes would have added some composure.
 

Uppercut

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Still don't think Real Madrid are as good as people on here are saying, up to this year they've been ordinary in the CL, they comprehensively beat the Spuds, but so what?
Yeah, it's fair to ask what they've actually achieved to be rated so highly. It's just that when you watch them play a few times the fact that they're comfortably the second best team in the world becomes painfully obvious very quickly.
 

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Probably not much, but might have made it slightly harder for Barca's midfield to run circles around United. Also, when you have the ball for such brief periods, you have to use it very effectively and Scholes is a great passer and switches play very well. Mind you, I doubt Busquets and co. would have given him much space and time to do his thing, but at least it would have made the midfield a bit congested.

As it was, Carrick and Giggs were invisible. Valencia ran around fouling people. Park ran around. Man United offered virtually no threat for the brief periods when they had the ball because they were far too impatient to get rid of it, Scholes would have added some composure.
You're talking about theoretical Scholes. Real Scholes has been below par for months and shouldn't be anywhere near a CL final starting team.

Fletcher and Anderson were both better options if we played a five-man midfield. But Fletcher's match fitness can't be relied upon, and Anderson gets visibly disheartened and goes missing when the midfield is being owned.

Fact is, we didn't really have the players to do anything differently.
 
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Furball

Evil Scotsman
Out of interest, how does Scholes at his peak half a dozen years ago compare to the current Xavi?
Different players IMO. Peak Scholes was best in the number 10 position.

Xavi's the finest midfielder I've ever seen. Scholes is the finest English player I've seen since Gascoigne.
 

Craig

World Traveller
It's interesting that Xavi often considers it an honour that he is compared to somebody like Scholes and would have fitted in well at Barca.

So what do people think of Guardiola as a manager? Obviously having such a strong team can make it look pretty easy to win everything, but it's because of that is the reason I don't think he has it easy at Barcelona, if they don't live up to expectations, then he will be out on his arse pretty quickly. I'm not saying he is bad or anything like that, but I think the best way to properly judge him is when he eventually manages a different team, one not as awesome as the one that he has now.
 

vcs

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Different players IMO. Peak Scholes was best in the number 10 position.

Xavi's the finest midfielder I've ever seen. Scholes is the finest English player I've seen since Gascoigne.
Agree with that. I think Xavi has done enough in the last few years to be rated alongside the likes of Zidane, though they are slightly different players and their peaks didn't overlap.
 

Furball

Evil Scotsman
It's interesting that Xavi often considers it an honour that he is compared to somebody like Scholes and would have fitted in well at Barca.

So what do people think of Guardiola as a manager? Obviously having such a strong team can make it look pretty easy to win everything, but it's because of that is the reason I don't think he has it easy at Barcelona, if they don't live up to expectations, then he will be out on his arse pretty quickly. I'm not saying he is bad or anything like that, but I think the best way to properly judge him is when he eventually manages a different team, one not as awesome as the one that he has now.
That does a huge disservice to the job Guardiola's done at Barcelona. They finished 3rd in Rijkaard's last season and Rijkaard's team didn't play football anywhere near to the level Guardiola's had his players playing at for the last 3 years.

Guardiola IMO was and is the perfect fit for Barcelona. Yes, he's had some excellent players to work with but it was Guardiola who was responsible for the signings of Alves, Pique and Villa. As 'B' team manager before he got the first team job, he was also responsible for developing both Busquets and Pedro away from the glare of the first team and he's continued with their development since they broke into the side. He was also a huge influence on Xavi as a kid, the pair of them played together for Barcelona and IMO it's no coincidence that over the last 10 years La Masia has been a school for great midfielders looking up to Guardiola, and more recently being coached by him. As well as Xavi, Iniesta and Busquets, La Masia has also produced Cesc Fabregas and Mikel Arteta. That's a phenominal group of midfielders to have come through one academy.

Barcelona's success is what happens when you have a youth academy that works and players who all come through the system playing the same way. Given the influence Guardiola's had in the development of so many of his players, be it as a team-mate, youth coach or first team coach, it's doing the guy a huge disservice to say 'oh, winning things is easy with such a great team.' That completely ignores the role that Guardiola's played in shaping those players to play in a particular way.

Having said that I doubt he'd be as big a success away from Barcelona. He's been the right man at the right time for the club, but I think if he was to move elsewhere you'd need to give him about 5 years before you could expect him to deliver results the way he has at Barcelona. To expect more would be to misunderstand why he's been so enormously successful at Barcelona.

Not that Barcelona necessarily need to worry about losing him. His influence has been such that anyone could now walk into that job and carry on winning things with the current team. It'll be interesting to see how Luis Enrique does if he replaces Pep and what his influence, both on the current squad and the next batch of talent, is likely to be like.
 

Craig

World Traveller
I'm not disputing that, I'm staying that gives the appearance to an outsider that it looks easy. Luis Enrique has been sounded out for the Roma job, but is so a whole lot of people seeing as though they are now loaded.
 

Cevno

Hall of Fame Member
Clive Tyldesley - "I can't help but wonder what difference Darren Fletcher would have made tonight."
I agree with this.

For the pressing game United tried to play yesterday a fully fit in form Fletcher was key for us.
He has been unlucky to miss two finals in a row against Barca.

Carrick is more of a sit and let play happen in front kind of midfielder and yesterday when he was asked to press them high due to his mobility got caught out a few times.

Even a fully fit Owen Hargreaves would have made a massive difference to the pressing game with the tenacity and energy ,but have forgotten how that looks like almost:(.

Fabregas commented before the match ,how Fletcher was key for United here and how good he harrases players in the midfield after having felt it so many times playing against him for Arsenal.
 
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Nate

You'll Never Walk Alone
As much as I don't like Fletcher, I reckon he's been one of MU's best this season.

EDIT: Also, what a fantastic game. Alves and Valencia the best on either side.









































:vampire:
 
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Furball

Evil Scotsman
So FIFA are a bunch of corrupt bastards. Who knew?

The FA would do world football a hell of a lot of good by resigning from FIFA.
 

Nate

You'll Never Walk Alone
The kick off tonight is at 12am Australian Time. Pretty exited. Much to like about Swansea's football, but admittedly I know little about Reading.
 

ripper868

International Coach
Hoping Swansea Get in. If nothing than to hear the englishmen squirm about a welsh side being in the EPL. "**** off to your own league" etc etc.
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
Hoping Swansea Get in. If nothing than to hear the englishmen squirm about a welsh side being in the EPL. "**** off to your own league" etc etc.
My main beef isn'[t that they're Welsh but that they're scum

O)f course, you may try and find a causal link there and don't let me stop you :p
 

BoyBrumby

Englishman
Lol, Fletcher is dire.
True, but Fletcher on one leg > Carrick.

Meanwhile, 'Mon the Royals. Cry God for fred, Harry & St George, etc.

As an aside, when I was very little I was under the assumption that Swansea were a big team because in one of the very first seasons I can personally remember they were up challenging for the title. Had a team with some cleverly procured old hands in like Bob Latchford and Ray Kennedy (:wub:). If not for the Swans John Toshack would never have managed Real Madrid.
 

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