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Cevno
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  • Neither Xavi nor Carrick are creative passers in the sense that they make key passes at a high rate per game***

    They do (especially Xavi) get their fair share of assists, but on the whole they're not amongst the most creative players in the world.
    2:
    Schweinsteiger, Xavi, Busquets are all close to 100 passes per game at a very high accuracy rate. Carrick passes around 70 passes at mid-80s % accuracy. That's Gerrard. They're both very good, but not in that top top echelon. In Gerrard's case, he is also a creative force and amongst the best in Europe...even that deep. In a way he is like Pirlo - regista with fantastic passing as well as a high amount of key passes.
    1: Goals conceded is obvious. Tackles, interceptions, clearances, etc are all considered. You can find them on Whoscored.com. Carrick does not have a high-work rate. Especially for someone who is the lone holding midfielder.

    No, Gerrard did not play at a more advanced position. He and Lucas played on the same line as holding midfielders. Gerrard played more of a regista than Lucas hence his creative stats.

    Neither Xavi nor Carrick are creative passers in the sense that they make key passes (the pass to the guy who gives the pass to create a goal or shot on goal). They are volume passers designed to knit the play, give breathers and recycle the possession.

    Carrick's role is not played by Martinez (which has also changed this year). Carrick is the number one passing option in the deep-lying midfield positions. Martinez is more like Lucas.
    Dunno, what exact stats you are referring to tbh that measure goals conceded and defensive midfielders contribution to that. But Gerrard played a more advanced compared to Carrick even at Liverpool last season at times and you can twist stats whatever way you like without context and give equal stats the other way round too to suit your agenda. For example i remember having a argument about Xavi with someone recently and using similar sort of stats and comparison to other players without any context or understanding the roles.

    Anyways, Carricks's role for Bayern is played by Martinez, In Barca by Busquets. Xavi plays the deep lying playmaker ahead of Busquets at Barca and controls the game with his passing, while Schweinsteiger's passing is not in the same category but he goes more box to box and contributes more vertically and in terms of direct contribution to goals.
    FTR, when I refer to creativity, I am including a pass to the person who assists someone else. All that you mention (creative passing from the deep, defensive output, goals conceded) are measured by Opta one way or another. They're not perfect, but they're not going to give you a wild view on a player if you interpret them with some common sense. Carrick is simply average at all those facets (key passes, tackles, interceptions, etc). The one facet he is very high on is volume passing + accuracy. He was 3rd last year IIRC; Gerrard was 4th. In terms of chance creation, only Baines, Silva and Cazorla created more chances last year than Gerrard - Mata comes next.

    Schweinsteiger and Xavi play almost the same exact role in their teams at both club level and national team. It's a similar role to Carrick, apart from the fact that they're much more mobile, get far more touches and are superior accurate passers.
    Cevno! Sorry bro, I saw your PM to me on CricSim. I haven't figured out how to respond to those on there, and have had very little time as well. But as I promised Daemon, I'll get on there as soon as I get some free time.
    yeah i made spikeys one. well modified two gifs anyway. they just need to be small and upload to photobucket or wherever
    Will read that, cheers.

    However, In the newspaper industry, only two papers I'd say are acceptable quality, for me. The Hindu and The Indian Express. Even the Hindu annoys me at times. IE is way ahead of the competition IMO.
    Did not want to derail that thread but TOI is the No. 1 newspaper n India too but I think its a filthy rag.
    Google is your friend. I shall reply in detail later on cricsim message anyway.
    Hey Cevno. I have always enjoyed our debates, but I am sure you have seen what Sanz called me in the Imran thread. What do you make of that?
    Yeah, I'll see if I can make an account at the start of next month. I'll be slightly less busy by then.

    Can't wait for the game on Sunday!
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