The tier below the fab 4

[Burgey]

Was a big effort, drawing a must-win third match of a four match series......

 

[OverratedSanity]

Well, blame Dhoni for that, not the two batsmen who scored 250 in 50 overs.

 

[Burgey]

The partnership was meaningless. It was a centre wicket practice session by then, because the game and series were over.

 

[Zinzan]

The Prince's death hit Johnson pretty hard by all reports. He admitted he never felt the same about sconing blokes again.

That last Indian tour here was a weird-feeling summer. The whole season was just effected by what happened in that Shield game. Cricket really didn't seem that important to a lot of blokes, and understandably so

Yup, was pretty obvious Johnson had nowhere near the venom he did 12 months earlier, I remember wondering if he was carrying a niggle at the time, but that makes sense in hindsight. I might be wrong, but couldn't imagine Rahane hooking and pulling at will facing what the poms did 12 months prior.

 

[Adders]

Yeah if Joe Root couldn't do it then obviously Rahane wouldn't have been able to........I mean hes not even a member of the Fab 4 FFS.

 

[Zinzan]

Lol, that was some pretty ferocious bowling in 2013 tbf. Who knows, maybe Rahane might has walloped him at all parts, but I doubt it.

 

[Burgey]

Yeah if Joe Root couldn't do it then obviously Rahane wouldn't have been able to........I mean hes not even a member of the Fab 4 FFS.

Quite. That knock from Rahane, meaningless and inconsequential though it was, really belongs in the players performing beyond expectations thread. It was analogous to Butcher's knock in 2001 - a pretty ordinary player punching well above his weight and making a ton. Good on them both and all, but really, what did it achieve in Rahane's case? At least Butcher got his side over the line.

 

[vic_orthdox]

Cumulative effect too. India batted well enough to keep Johnson and Australia in the field for a long time in the series up to that, and we're talking about a guy who was well over 30 at the time. He certainly wasn't bowling the same stuff he did the previous years, and the wickets in the series didn't help it, but India handled him a lot better than England did as well.

Probably a bit more familiarity with the "new Johnson" as well through ODIs and IPL. He'd been over there a fair bit since his injury lay off.

 

[Contra]

Rahane at MCG was one of the best examples of attacking batsmen-ship I've seen. It's a massive stretch to simply say Johnson wasn't the same, yeah sure the wickets were relatively flat and the death of Hughes might have affected him a bit. But there were definitely times during that series where Johnson had his tail up and at no point did I get the impression that Johnson was going through the motions, maybe in the first innings of the first test but after that he was trying his hardest to bowl as well as he can, and even during that 3rd day he had Kohli lose his focus after trying to run him out and had him dropped by watson at slip.

The difference between England 2013 and when India played is A) Johnson bowled longer spells during the India series (he said so himself that his role was to bowl in short bursts) and B) India actually attacked him when he bowled pies, whereas England just kept defending all the way through, giving him nothing to worry about.

Lets also not forget that Kohli was in arguably the worst form as a test cricketer prior to that series, so its not just Johnson who was "out of form" so to speak.

 

[Contra]

Quite. That knock from Rahane, meaningless and inconsequential though it was, really belongs in the players performing beyond expectations thread. It was analogous to Butcher's knock in 2001 - a pretty ordinary player punching well above his weight and making a ton. Good on them both and all, but really, what did it achieve in Rahane's case? At least Butcher got his side over the line.

So any performance by anyone in tests that don't result in a team victory are automatically meaningless?

 

[Burgey]

No, that's silly. But this one was.

 

[Contra]

No, that's silly. But this one was.

Ok then...

 

[OverratedSanity]

Literally the test before Melbourne, Johnson tore India apart. The pitch was undoubtedly slower at Melbourne, but I'm not sure I buy that Johnson became some trundler like some are saying. He was an inferior version of the 13/14 version but saying he didn't even touch 140 is incredibly OTT.

 

[Burgey]

Look at the context. 2-0 down (as always when playing here) in a four test series, with the hosts having piled on 500 plus and batted India out of the test. Series - gone. Win - gone.

They went out and had a bit of fun in a dead rubber and made some runs on a flat day three deck against an attack that cbf because they'd already won the series. The Rahane innings would properly rank at #6,232 in DOG's Greatest Innings rankings.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Rahane at MCG was one of the best examples of attacking batsmen-ship I've seen. It's a massive stretch to simply say Johnson wasn't the same, yeah sure the wickets were relatively flat and the death of Hughes might have affected him a bit. But there were definitely times during that series where Johnson had his tail up and at no point did I get the impression that Johnson was going through the motions, maybe in the first innings of the first test but after that he was trying his hardest to bowl as well as he can, and even during that 3rd day he had Kohli lose his focus after trying to run him out and had him dropped by watson at slip.

The difference between England 2013 and when India played is A) Johnson bowled longer spells during the India series (he said so himself that his role was to bowl in short bursts) and B) India actually attacked him when he bowled pies, whereas England just kept defending all the way through, giving him nothing to worry about.

Lets also not forget that Kohli was in arguably the worst form as a test cricketer prior to that series, so its not just Johnson who was "out of form" so to speak.

I like what you're trying to say but it's all very, very wrong

Johnson in that Test at the MCG was out of it. Might as well have been Nathan Bracken.

Literally the test before Melbourne, Johnson tore India apart. The pitch was undoubtedly slower at Melbourne, but I'm not sure I buy that Johnson became some trundler like some are saying. He was an inferior version of the 13/14 version but saying he didn't even touch 140 is incredibly OTT.

He might have touched 140 briefly. He was mostly Low-Mid 130s

 

[Contra]

I like what you're trying to say but it's all very, very wrong

Johnson in that Test at the MCG was out of it. Might as well have been Nathan Bracken.

Whatever helps you sleep at night bro.

 

[vic_orthdox]

I like what you're trying to say but it's all very, very wrong

Johnson in that Test at the MCG was out of it. Might as well have been Nathan Bracken.



He might have touched 140 briefly. He was mostly Low-Mid 130s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VfiNB_miko

Go to 4:30 of this clip. He's bowling over 140km/h sniffs - which usually pick up slower on the radar. They were getting stuck in the wicket a bit more, especially compared to Brisbane and the year before. Every ball on these highlights that features Johnson is over 140km/h, except a slower ball bouncer.

More than anything, it's the difference between being on 80 and facing this stuff, versus doing it straight up. The first two of those pull shots would be a dismissal if they were played before he was properly "in".

 

[TheJediBrah]

Whatever helps you sleep at night bro.

lol wut

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VfiNB_miko

Go to 4:30 of this clip. He's bowling over 140km/h sniffs - which usually pick up slower on the radar. They were getting stuck in the wicket a bit more, especially compared to Brisbane the year before. Every ball on these highlights that features Johnson is over 140km/h, except a slower ball bouncer.

Yeah but every other ball he bowled not in the highlights was 125kph at most

trust me

 

[vic_orthdox]

'I have the best memory, no one has a better memory than me. You would not believe the amount of things that I can remember. Trust me'

 

[Burgey]

Notice it took the WPNCOS to break the partnership.