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Thread: Manufactured openers' success

  1. #16
    Evil Scotsman Furball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    You may see no reason but there's plenty of them - and those reasons are why batsmen don't often cope with being elevated to the top of the order having spent a fair while at a serious, high-level level of cricket batting in the middle.

    There are no shortage of people who can do it, given the countless millions of people who play cricket, but as a percentage they're small and most don't even try.
    What exactly are these reasons?

    You're stating your opinion without actually giving a reason for why you believe that to be the case.

  2. #17
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Uppercut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Alex View Post
    I am glad such outtdated theories are getting chucked out of the window... remnants of the colonial period of strict job allocation and adherence..
    Lol.

  3. #18
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uppercut View Post
    Lol.
    "Now that they are shedding off the last remnants of colonial past, they want to assert themselves, and assert they will."
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uppercut View Post
    Lol.
    Constructive I see.


  5. #20
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Uppercut's Avatar
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    Haha, well if you say something funny it's not unreasonable to expect people to laugh.

  6. #21
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post
    "Now that they are shedding off the last remnants of colonial past, they want to assert themselves, and assert they will."
    A prize for the first to tell me who said this btw.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post
    A prize for the first to tell me who said this btw.
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  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uppercut View Post
    Haha, well if you say something funny it's not unreasonable to expect people to laugh.
    I am not sure what you found funny in that. For centuries cricket has been confined to colonial establishments hardly venturing beyond the commonwealth. Alongwith it came the rigourous discipline in observing standards and "text book" stuff even though there is no point in it. No wonder the most successful batsmen today are guys who are "unorthodox" like Sehwag, Hayden, Tendulkar to some extent than guys like Ian Bell, Alistair cook etc.

  9. #24
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Uppercut's Avatar
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    It's just funny to compare Richard's ideals of only opening batsmen opening the batting to the strict division of labour of colonial times. Trade unions used to be crazy about it over here. Trade unions would object any time a non-engineer did a little bit of work normally done by the engineers, so paranoid were they that their jobs were under threat.

    Richard's theories on opening batsmen remind me of that. Despite Sehwag obviously doing a significantly better job opening the batting than any "real" opening batsman in the world, he objects because he isn't a qualified member of the Opening Batsmen's Union as defined by him. It's absurd. All I could say was "Lol."

  10. #25
    Evil Scotsman Furball's Avatar
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    I can see merit in Richard's ideals, but we don't live in an ideal world.

    With a decline in fast bowling standards and more batsman friendly pitches, there's no reason why a prolific middle order batsman shouldn't be equally successful opening the innings.

    Even in a return to a more ideal world of bowler friendly pitches and top quality pace attacks, there's still no reason why a successful middle order bat with the correct skill set (the most glaring example being Rahul Dravid) couldn't become a successful opener.

  11. #26
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    Dravid being, ironically, crap at opening.

  12. #27
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uppercut View Post
    Dravid being, ironically, crap at opening.
    I honestly think he'd be better at it if he more of a go at it TBH. The first thing to note is that he's often been in iffy form before opening or after opening anyway, so his record opening isn't a representation of what it would look like if he did it permanently. I also think he's just convinced himself that he's crap at it which obviously can't have a positive effect on him.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uppercut View Post
    It's just funny to compare Richard's ideals of only opening batsmen opening the batting to the strict division of labour of colonial times. Trade unions used to be crazy about it over here. Trade unions would object any time a non-engineer did a little bit of work normally done by the engineers, so paranoid were they that their jobs were under threat.

    Richard's theories on opening batsmen remind me of that. Despite Sehwag obviously doing a significantly better job opening the batting than any "real" opening batsman in the world, he objects because he isn't a qualified member of the Opening Batsmen's Union as defined by him. It's absurd. All I could say was "Lol."
    Ok. Thanks for clearing that up. I was not replying to Richard but to the opening post.

  14. #29
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    Need to separate the LHBs from the RHBs.
    LHBs enjoy such a big advantage that usually if they are patient ala Katich, Prince, Smith, Strauss, Gambhir or even Hughes, they will end up being successful.

    Now which are the RHB openers who dont meet the "necessary" skills, but are successful?
    Sehwag, Dilshan, Watson, and ? I cant think of any more. Sehwag is a separate case altogether. Dilshan and Watson are just starting out. Watson has already had trouble opening in ODIs. I'm positive that they wont last long as openers.

  15. #30
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Uppercut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post
    I honestly think he'd be better at it if he more of a go at it TBH. The first thing to note is that he's often been in iffy form before opening or after opening anyway, so his record opening isn't a representation of what it would look like if he did it permanently. I also think he's just convinced himself that he's crap at it which obviously can't have a positive effect on him.
    Yeah, that's it.

    The main difference between opening and batting 3 or 4 is just the mental aspect. If conditions and bowling are difficult enough to require a specific technique to navigate the new ball then 9 times out of 10 you'll be facing new ball bowling in the middle order anyway.

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