Are you confident in the ICC?

[garage flower]

Whether anyone likes it or not, this new report has totally exposed the hollowness of earlier claims.

I am all for a uniform, verifiable (preferably on the field of play) criteria of what constitutes a throw. But you cant shift goal posts depending upon who or how many people are affected ?

The 5, 7.5, 10 15% criteria for different types of bowling was totally arbitrary and ridiculous. All it achieved was to disallow one particular type of bowling from Murali's armoury, nothing more. But we all pretended that it was fair and scietific and therefore objective. If anything, some felt that it should be tighter, basically because it allowed Murali to still bowl other deliveries which were also bowled with a bent elbow.

Now when they find others are also transgressing this 'arbitrary' limit fixed, they flex it to 'accomodate' them. Why ? If they can show this flexibility for a few why shouldnt it be shown for one Murali. Where is the logic that a 'throw' is not a 'throw' if a larger number of people employ it ?

Either they were wrong then in banning the doosra or they are wrong now in allowing it.Whcichever is true does no credit to ICC or the 'experts' involved in the decision making. I suspect it is worse than being wrong. It doesnt matter to ICC any more whether what they hand out is right or wrong, all that matters is, what is more 'convinient' and more politically palatable !!

The most recent research suggests that establishing “uniform, verifiable criteria of what constitutes a throw” is impossible because the very definition of “throwing” in cricket needs to be revised.

The limits will, as you point out, always be arbitrary, but at least now there is one limit for all bowlers and it is based on what appears to be a comprehensive piece of scientific research.

The next big hoo-hah will occur when a new bowling sensation arrives on the scene with a dodgy-looking action that is found to straighten by 16 degrees!

I have some sympathy for the ICC on this issue. Perhaps there should be no “legal limit” and it should be left to umpires to refer any actions or individual deliveries they are concerned about. Tests could be performed and an objective view on the legality taken, based primarily on the extent to which the action in question straightens compared to other bowlers.

 

[Slow Love™]

I answered "couldn't organize a pi$$-up in a brewery" just because it was the most negative response available. I would go so far as to say that the ICC was immorally coercive, and malevolently destructive to the sport in many contexts - Zimbabwe, the chucking affair (WHICHEVER side you come from), corporate sponsorship/ambush marketing, etc... I've said before that I would favor their present structure being dissolved, and becoming more the "common meeting ground" for international representatives that they were previous to the 80's.

In terms of managing fixtures though, they're probably competent enough (some off-season climatic mistakes notwithstanding). So they could probably run an ice cream in the desert (even if that might mean forcing people to buy them).

 

[Slow Love™]

Now when they find others are also transgressing this 'arbitrary' limit fixed, they flex it to 'accomodate' them. Why ? If they can show this flexibility for a few why shouldnt it be shown for one Murali. Where is the logic that a 'throw' is not a 'throw' if a larger number of people employ it ?

Either they were wrong then in banning the doosra or they are wrong now in allowing it.Whcichever is true does no credit to ICC or the 'experts' involved in the decision making. I suspect it is worse than being wrong. It doesnt matter to ICC any more whether what they hand out is right or wrong, all that matters is, what is more 'convinient' and more politically palatable !!

I agree with your criticisms on how the matter has been handled up to now, but pragmatically, what kind of solution would you advise from here, given that the two options are a) ban all these bowlers or b) try and find a degree of straightening that we can count on 99% of bowlers will comply with?

 

[Langeveldt]

What will they do if another survey in two year's time shows ninety percent of the bowlers in the world bend between 16 and 19 degrees ??

Hike the limit to 20, then 25 !!!
.

Basically that will happen, yeah.. And we will all be playing Twenty20 cricket the whole year round..

Across the Atlantic they call that baseball...

 

[Sanz]

I agree with your criticisms on how the matter has been handled up to now, but pragmatically, what kind of solution would you advise from here, given that the two options are a) ban all these bowlers or b) try and find a degree of straightening that we can count on 99% of bowlers will comply with?

I got one solution mate and I bet that will make most people on this board happy.

 

[Legglancer]

I got one solution mate and I bet that will make most people on this board happy.

I hope it does not involve the death of Murali .....

 

[Slow Love™]

I got one solution mate and I bet that will make most people on this board happy.

Does it involve JustTool and Scallywag in a no holes barred, "two men enter, neither man leaves" grudge match inside a lead-lined cell? Because, even though that might make most people on this board very happy, I don't know how it resolves the chucking situation.

 

[Scaly piscine]

Basically that will happen, yeah.. And we will all be playing Twenty20 cricket the whole year round..

Across the Atlantic they call that baseball...

Before I start unjustified ranting, could you clarify that you're indeed saying 20 over cricket = baseball there?

 

[LongHopCassidy]

Before I start unjustified ranting, could you clarify that you're indeed saying 20 over cricket = baseball there?

Well, it is played at about the same speed.

 

[Warne is god]

The ICCD (International Cricket Council of Dickhea*s) couldn't run a local ping pong tournament without fuc**ng it up.

 

[Craig]

The last World Cup was a shambles and it was a miracle the Champions Trophy wasn't infinitely worse being held in September. Then there's the Zimbabwe situation - How the hell am I the only one who voted for the couldn't organise a pi........... so far?

Almost forgot the Kenya situation as well - no matches for 18 months, unbelievable. Any remotely competent sport governing body would have had them playing Tests let alone one-dayers at a competitive level by now.

Test cricket? No, we shouldn't pass around Test status out like a piece pipe. It has to be earned then one flukey tournament and to the fact that New Zealand didn't go to Kenya to play their group match.

But I agree with the lack of ODIs being playedd. Even the Farore Islands play more internationals then them.

 

[SJS]

I agree with your criticisms on how the matter has been handled up to now, but pragmatically, what kind of solution would you advise from here, given that the two options are a) ban all these bowlers or b) try and find a degree of straightening that we can count on 99% of bowlers will comply with?

TODAY, I dont know. The pitch has been queered by the ICC to such an extent that going back to what was the best possible option(leave it to the umpires and their 'visual' judgement and trust their impartiality) is not possible NOW.

So today ICC is in a spot and is trying to do 'something' but I am questioning their motives. This pandering to interests OR avoiding a major crisis OR sweeping under the carpet OR adjusting the laws to avoid taking difficult decisions is not befitting a premium body like ICC.

 

[marc71178]

The ICCD (International Cricket Council of Dickhea*s) couldn't run a local ping pong tournament without fuc**ng it up.

They are nowhere near that bad.

 

[Scaly piscine]

Test cricket? No, we shouldn't pass around Test status out like a piece pipe. It has to be earned then one flukey tournament and to the fact that New Zealand didn't go to Kenya to play their group match.

But I agree with the lack of ODIs being playedd. Even the Farore Islands play more internationals then them.

If they'd have been given regular, proper first class games then they've have built up to Test standard (better than Zimbabwe or Bangladesh at least) by now. They as a race have the same (at least) natural physical size generally as WI but with a bigger population. They could quite easy churn out a dozen Ambroses (with a bit less skill obviously).

 

[Langeveldt]

Before I start unjustified ranting, could you clarify that you're indeed saying 20 over cricket = baseball there?

Twenty20 cricket where everyone chucks because it's now okay is not very different to baseball.. Fast paced, good fielding, throwing, big hitting.. And I love both of them..

 

[Scaly piscine]

Twenty20 cricket where everyone chucks because it's now okay is not very different to baseball.. Fast paced, good fielding, throwing, big hitting.. And I love both of them..

Baseball is fast paced?!? Lets see, you get about 250 pitches or so, that's about the same in terms of deliveries. But half of them are left alone entirely, then you get the steroid guzzlers who couldn't hit a cow's back end with a banjo. So in the end you get about 20 balls that just go straight in the air and some guy catches it with a bucket. Then there's the odd ball that dribbles along the ground and in between you'll get a few 'walks' (yes they're as exciting as they sound folks) and the odd 'hit' and if you're really lucky a home run, so not much big hitting either then.

In 20 over cricket virtually every delivery something happens, catching is a skill unlike in baseball and the fielders have 3 stumps (at most) to hit direct and there's not usually time to set yourself to throw properly which makes it far more skilful. There is far more big hitting - expect 30 boundaries a game at the very least. Also the batters can actually play more than one shot and are infinitely more skilled than their baseball counterparts also unlike most 'pitchers' bowlers don't have a gut Rik Waller would be proud of.


Thread Content: Am I confident in the ICC? NO

 

[Langeveldt]

I guess you must hate test cricket with all that leaving the ball.. And as for Merv Hughes and Shane Warne, fat guys? Waste of space!!

Anyway the last bit is spot on

 

[Scaly piscine]

And as for Merv Hughes and Shane Warne, fat guys?

Yea, fat and even worse... Australian

Waste of space!!

You could be right there

Thread content: ICC racism is despicable

 

[Langeveldt]

Thread content: ICC racism is despicable

Yep.. I thought the disposed Zimbo cricketers would be shown a bit of sympathy from the ICC... Pity really..

 

[SquidAU]

The ICC has made a farce of the Zimbabwe and Murali issue. Just sweeping it under the rug really.....