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Thread: *Official* Fourth Test at Headingley

  1. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie View Post
    Headingley if my memory is correct ATM, hasn't swung since Caddick took 4 wickets vs WI in 2000. Its be very flat since.
    The SAJ took 4 wickets in this match. 3rd Test: England v Pakistan at Leeds, Aug 4-8, 2006 | Cricket Scorecard | Cricinfo.com

    Hoggy took 4 in this 2nd Test: England v New Zealand at Leeds, Jun 3-7, 2004 | Cricket Scorecard | Cricinfo.com

    Steyn and Morkel 2nd Test: England v South Africa at Leeds, Jul 18-21, 2008 | Cricket Scorecard | Cricinfo.com 4 each.

  2. #167
    International Coach PhoenixFire's Avatar
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    I've probably seen more cricket at Headingley than any one else here (without sounding cocky or whatever) and nearly every game I have seen there has ended up with at least one team getting a below par score even when it has been sunny. Not sure what to make of that.
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  3. #168
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie
    07 the swing Sidebottom got againts was woefully exaggerated by the poor techniques of the WI batsmen.
    So the ball takes into account the quality of the batsman before deciding whether to swing or not?

    It doesn't matter how many wickets he got or how good the batsmen were - he swung the ball around corners in that game.
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  4. #169
    Cricketer Of The Year four_or_six's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie View Post
    Well given the tactics going into the 3rd test was to pick Watson in place of Hughes because they where sure he could bowl as an all-rounder & he bowled that utter rubbish, the credibility of the team management should be in question.

    AFAIC is just the ideological premise of not wanting to pick 4-seamers.
    Actually, they were stressing that it was as much a batting decision as a bowling one, and personally I think that even if it was a 100% batting decision you could at least make a case for it. And yeah, he definitely bowled rubbish, but he's not the only Aussie seamer this series that's started off with three overs of rubbish.


  5. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by four_or_six View Post
    Actually, they were stressing that it was as much a batting decision as a bowling one, and personally I think that even if it was a 100% batting decision you could at least make a case for it. And yeah, he definitely bowled rubbish, but he's not the only Aussie seamer this series that's started off with three overs of rubbish.
    Yeah agree with the part about it would make sense if it was 100% about batting (which it couldn't have been). Watson has looked pretty damn good when I've seen him, a lot better than Hughes has.

  6. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post
    Oh, and anyone who talks down Swann's efforts in the West Indies..
    • Didn't watch him actually bowl in that series.
    • Didn't see how ridiculously flat the pitches were.
    • Didn't witness the lack of support he was getting.
    • Criminally under-rates Chanderpaul and Sarwan against spin.
    Indeed, and lets just throw the fact that Murali averaged over 30 when he toured the WI only a year before against a similar batting side.

    No matter how many times I watch the 2 bowl, I simply cannot fathom how Hauritz has more variations than Swann. The only variation Hauritz has is throwing the ball a bit further up in the air. Swann, on the other hand, I feel spends too much time trying too many different things that he forgets about the reliability of his stock ball and sticking to the basics of line and length. This is why he bowls soo many goddamn full tosses.
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  7. #172
    Hall of Fame Member TT Boy's Avatar
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    Interesting squad. If Fred is indeed ruled out, I hope Sidebottom comes in for Broad and have Trott as the extra batsman. Andy Flower said no matter what Ravi will be batting at 3, so Trott if he does play he will bat 6, Prior 7.

    Watch out if Trott plays for the LBW, his more onside than Ravi...

  8. #173
    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pigeon View Post
    Ha & Mahmood is a swing bowler right?. Thats was a flat pitch hands down.

    So. That doesn't mean it was a seamers deck, thats was just Hoggard utilizing the conditions in that innings.


    Leeds was flat last year no question. Stop stats picking, Morkel aint no swing bowler come on now. England's 1st innings collapse was down to poor selection & batting.

  9. #174
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by social View Post
    Sorry Richard but it's Eng against Aus in Eng

    Swann is averaging NEARLY 60 inthis series because whether away or at home, he is a very average bowler against this Oz batting lineup

    Horses for courses and Eng have backed the wrong horse
    I don't particularly like repeating myself but sometimes it's neccessary.

    I'm not talking about who's backed the right horse, but whether Swann or Hauritz is a better bowler.
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  10. #175
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pup11 View Post
    So why is his FC average 33, shouldn't he be ripping through hapless English batsmen on receptive pitches.
    England won't always bat this badly against nothing spin as they have this series. In any case, Swann's First-Class career, like any lengthy career, is not summed-up by one single figure.

  11. #176
    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post
    So the ball takes into account the quality of the batsman before deciding whether to swing or not?

    It doesn't matter how many wickets he got or how good the batsmen were - he swung the ball around corners in that game.
    No i'm just saying a better team would have played Sidebottom better. It was just like @ Durham again this, if your technique is bad you will be awful over. Lendl Simmons woes is a perfect example.

  12. #177
    Hall of Fame Member TT Boy's Avatar
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    Rob Key unlucky not to get the call, his recent form has been superb and his been there and done that but he's coach isn't an England selector.
    Last edited by TT Boy; 04-08-2009 at 10:25 AM.

  13. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by TT Boy View Post
    Interesting squad. If Fred is indeed ruled out, I hope Sidebottom comes in for Broad and have Trott as the extra batsman. Andy Flower said no matter what Ravi will be batting at 3, so Trott if he does play he will bat 6, Prior 7.
    Yeah, agree strongly. I don't think Flintoff will be fit so I'd be picking this:

    1. Cook
    2. Strauss
    3. Bopara
    4. Bell
    5. Collingwood
    6. Trott
    7. Prior
    8. Swann
    9. Anderson
    10. Sidebottom
    11. Onions

    There's an understandable case for picking Broad is Flintoff is fit and batting seven (balances the team, fifth bowler not as important, batting is weakened with Flintoff, 1-0 etc etc), but with Sidebottom having just taken a bag, the game being in Leeds, Broad averaging about 70 in the series and Prior batting 7, there's little case for his selection if Flintoff's out.

  14. #179
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie View Post
    No i'm just saying a better team would have played Sidebottom better. It was just like @ Durham again this, if your technique is bad you will be awful over. Lendl Simmons woes is a perfect example.
    Not really relevant to whether the ball swung or not though, is it?

    Even if Sidebottom had somehow managed to take 0 wickets in that game bowling how he did, he still swung the ball around - it doesn't change that fact.

  15. #180
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by four_or_six View Post
    When I saw him play last summer he was more overweight then Gough, slower on the speed-gun than Gough, and looked completely ineffective. Granted, it was a one-day game, and he's never held them in any regard, but given that performance I could understand why he was no longer playing for England.
    As I say, if there were legions of quality bowlers banging in the figures like Hoggard still is despite the cosmetic effect he may convey, then his exclusion would make sense. When he's being overlooked for Darren Pattinson, Amjad Khan and Stuart Broad, it doesn't.

    And Gough has always been quicker than Hoggard. All career. Not remotely surprising to hear that. Gough simply has more talent for pace than Hoggard.



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