What does Kohli need to surpass Tendulkar?

[Adders]

Windies fans probably weren't too upset when Lara got out, they just shrugged and walked off to the beach for another pina colada under a palm tree.

When Tendulkar got out, Indian fans realised they were still in India. It's enough to piss anyone off.

LOL, I guess a harsh way of putting it but pretty accurate.

I think zinzan is underestimating just what Sachin meant to the Indian cricket fans and the additional pressure that came with that., It has nothing to do with averages or the fact he was head and shoulders above his peers (because he wasn't) but for a variety of reasons he was elevated into something much much more than just a cricketer, he was almost a living god to them. A ray of light and escape from the harsh realities of their lives.

The only other cricketer that comes remotely close to Tendulkar in terms of weight of expectation and carrying the hopes and dreams of a nation with him when coming out to bat, was Donald Bradman.

 

[Zinzan]

LOL, I guess a harsh way of putting it but pretty accurate.

I think zinzan is underestimating just what Sachin meant to the Indian cricket fans and the additional pressure that came with that., .

I'm not underestimating the fanaticism, just that the expectations made it that much harder for him to perform. The fact that fans seemed happy enough that his average was pretty much on par with the other great bats of his era, whilst still holding him up in a god-like status was actually a pretty good deal for him in many respects. Unless people are suggesting that he under-performed overall in his career according to his fans, but this doesn't seem to be the case.

He got to average 52 (or whatever it was) and yet still got held up in god-like status.

 

[sunilz]

I'm not underestimating the fanaticism, just that the expectations made it that much harder for him to perform. The fact that fans seemed happy enough that his average was pretty much on par with the other great bats of his era, whilst still holding him up in a god-like status was actually a pretty good deal for him in many respects. Unless people are suggesting that he under-performed overall in his career according to his fans, but this doesn't seem to be the case.

He got to average 52 (or whatever it was) and yet still got held up in god-like status.

You do realise most of the fans in Tendulkar's time didn't have access to cricinfo statsguru . So they relied on what was printed in media or during live commentary of matches.And according to media and commentators Tendulkar was head and shoulders above rest of the batsman of his era. And only Lara was considered competitor to Tendulkar

 

[sunilz]

Weren't you who suggested that Guptill is better opener than Rohit, Ganguly and Dhawan despite him being rubbish overseas
Batting records | One-Day Internationals | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo

Weren't u who also suggested than NZ AT XI is better than India ATXI despite them winning grand total of 4 multinational tournament
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...ype=3;tournament_type=5;type=team;view=series

ESPNcricinfo Statsguru - India - One-Day Internationals - Team analysis

So if u can come to pathetic conclusions despite all the access to cricinfo statsguru I would go easy on most of the Indian fans who never had internet connection during Tendulkar's era.
Why don't u look in the mirror before suggesting other of being deluded

 

[Zinzan]

Weren't u who also suggested than NZ AT XI is better than India ATXI despite them winning grand total of 4 multinational tournament
ESPNcricinfo Statsguru - New Zealand - One-Day Internationals - Team analysis

I said the NZ all time ODI XI and India's is pretty even in that although India clearly have the better batting line up, Hadlee, Bond, Chatfield & Vettori give NZ a huge advantage with the ball. Furthermore you do realize all-time XIs never actually played together right? So not sure what the point of discussing actual tournaments when the said lineups never played.

Re: Guptill, I argued he was as good as the likes of Rohit in ODIs about 18 months or so when I made that comment. Admittedly Guptill hasn't been as impressive as Rohit since then, so calm down.

 

[Zinzan]

You do realise most of the fans in Tendulkar's time didn't have access to cricinfo statsguru . So they relied on what was printed in media or during live commentary of matches.And according to media and commentators Tendulkar was head and shoulders above rest of the batsman of his era. And only Lara was considered competitor to Tendulkar

I repeat, the fact Sachin was held up as a god in spite of averaging just over 50, and hence significantly less than the likes of Sanga & Kallis (admmittedly he played for longer, but didn't have to keep or bat at 3 like Sanga did most of his career) was a good deal for him. The performance seemed to keep his fans happy most of the time.

 

[vcs]

The hero-worshipping phase was in the '90s and very few batsmen had his consistency across formats then.

 

[sunilz]

I repeat, the fact Sachin was held up as a god in spite of averaging just over 50, and hence significantly less than the likes of Sanga & Kallis (admmittedly he played for longer, but didn't have to keep or bat at 3 like Sanga did most of his career) was a good deal for him. The performance seemed to keep his fans happy most of the time.

You do realise for most of the Indian fans ODI > TEST. And the players u mentioned are nowthere near to Sachin in ODI.

In another unrelated news Pujara averages more than Martin crowe in test

 

[ankitj]

look in the mirror

Good advice for everyone. Especially those who get off on this forum by dissing the "ignorant" Indian fans from time to time.

 

[Gob]

ODIs matter ****

 

[ankitj]

In another unrelated news Pujara averages more than Martin crowe in test

Ouch

 

[Zinzan]

.And according to media and commentators Tendulkar was head and shoulders above rest of the batsman of his era. And only Lara was considered competitor to Tendulkar

Why don't u look in the mirror before suggesting other of being deluded

Lol, Wait, you're making me laugh now. Who's deluded exactly? Me, or the India media you describe at the time? "Head and shoulders above" when in the 90s Lara and S Waugh were definitely up there with him and it basically came down to personal preference, while in the 2000s Sanga, Kallis and Ponting were arguably better?

 

[sunilz]

I said the NZ all time ODI XI and India's is pretty even in that although India clearly have the better batting line up, Hadlee, Bond, Chatfield & Vettori give NZ a huge advantage with the ball. Furthermore you do realize all-time XIs never actually played together right? So not sure what the point of discussing actual tournaments when the said lineups never played.

Re: Guptill, I argued he was as good as the likes of Rohit in ODIs about 18 months or so when I made that comment. Admittedly Guptill hasn't been as impressive as Rohit since then, so calm down.

So NZ players who never had the experience of winning tournaments on their own will some how miracly start winning tournaments when they play tournaments.

If fans like u can suggest NZ AT XI is equal to IND AT XI , then Indian fans of 90s were not wrong in assuming Tendulkar would win them every game.

No of multination tournament won by NZ =4
No. of multination tournament won by IND=22

 

[Zinzan]

You do realise for most of the Indian fans ODI > TEST. And the players u mentioned are nowthere near to Sachin in ODI.

In another unrelated news Pujara averages more than Martin crowe in test

Nice one, bit like Stewie Dempster averaged more than Sachin. Fun game this one.

 

[sunilz]

Lol, Wait, you're making me laugh now. Who's deluded exactly? Me, or the India media you describe at the time? "Head and shoulders above" when in the 90s Lara and S Waugh were definitely up there with him and it basically came down to personal preference, while in the 2000s Sanga, Kallis and Ponting were arguably better?

So u can have your personal preference , while Indian fans can not have preference of assuming that Sachin would win them every game.Once again look in the mirror.
Love how u never include ODI stats.

 

[sunilz]

Nice one, bit like Stewie Dempster averaged more than Sachin. Fun game this one.

Who started this game of batting average of Tendulkar. I would leave it to rest of the people to judge who is more deluded, a normal Indian fan with no access to internet in 90s or U .

 

[Zinzan]

So NZ players who never had the experience of winning tournaments on their own will some how miracly start winning tournaments when they play tournaments.

If fans like u can suggest NZ AT XI is equal to IND AT XI , then Indian fans of 90s were not wrong in assuming Tendulkar would win them every game.

No of multination tournament won by NZ =4
No. of multination tournament won by IND=22

You don't seem to understand the concept of hypothetical all-time XIs do you? It's players across different eras. The question of which ODI team has been more successful in history, then India has been a more successful ODI team than NZ (just like Pakistan have been a better ODI side than India). This is a different question than the one of lining up the best XIs next to one another. When you do the latter, India clearly have the better batting line-up and New Zealand clearly the better bowling line-up (and fielding too while we're at it). I'd also argue Hadlee, Bond & possibly Vettori (if you consider his freakish ER in the era he played) were better than any ODI bowlers India have ever produced.

 

[ankitj]

Lol, Wait, you're making me laugh now. Who's deluded exactly? Me, or the India media you describe at the time? "Head and shoulders above" when in the 90s Lara and S Waugh were definitely up there with him and it basically came down to personal preference, while in the 2000s Sanga, Kallis and Ponting were arguably better?

You don't know your facts, do you?

Cricket Records | Records | 1990s | Test matches | Highest averages | ESPNcricinfo
Cricket Records | Records | 1990s | Test matches | Most hundreds | ESPNcricinfo

And anyway, let's say Indian fans suck and Indian media sucks, why do you want to keep repeating that when it has no relevance to the topic. May I suggest you to grow up, apart from buying a mirror?

 

[Zinzan]

Who started this game of batting average of Tendulkar. I would leave it to rest of the people to judge who is more deluded, a normal Indian fan with no access to internet in 90s or U .

You're contradicting yourself now, you just gave reasons for why fans were deluded - since they didn't have access to stats and instead relied on a biased home media, who overrated him. Then you call me deluded lol...ok.

Anyway, I'll leave it here. As usual, any slight questioning of Sachin with Indian fans always ends up in this type of emotional backlash and I really can't be arsed with a 100 to 1 pile on for the rest of the week.

 

[Zinzan]

You don't know your facts, do you?

Cricket Records | Records | 1990s | Test matches | Highest averages | ESPNcricinfo
Cricket Records | Records | 1990s | Test matches | Most hundreds | ESPNcricinfo

And anyway, let's say Indian fans suck and Indian media sucks, why do you want to keep repeating that when it has no relevance to the topic. May I suggest you to grow up, apart from buying a mirror?

I notice you didn't respond with the 2000s stats. Were they not quite so good for him?