The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[sunilz]

Well tbf Viv isn't a Top 10/15 batsman of all-time on raw stats. His impact goes far beyond that.

Don't u think same can be said about Gavaskar considering how difficult opening the batting is ?

 

[Coronis]

For taking 20 wickets in a match giving less than 30 runs per wicket and to score 500 plus runs in any condition the following team would be ideal.

Hutton
Hobbs
Bradman *
Viv Richards
Tendulkar
Sobers
Adam Gilchrist +
Imran Khan
Hadlee
Marshall
Warne


You can probably match the bowling with the following XI. But the batting quality difference will be significant.

Gavaskar
Hayden
Lara
Kallis
Hammond *
Sangakara +
Keith Miller
Akram
Steyn
Murali
McGrath

Hayden over Sutcliffe?

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

Well tbf Viv isn't a Top 10/15 batsman of all-time on raw stats. His impact goes far beyond that.

Same applies to Trumper, Gavaskar, Sobers, Akram, Kapil, Miller, Lillee, Gilly.. Etc

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

That is because he scored double century in test in which neither Imran nor Qadir played

2nd Test, Australia tour of Pakistan at Faisalabad, Mar 6-11 1980 | Match Summary | ESPNCricinfo

So Greg chappell who doesn't have even 500 runs in Asia is now ATG

Thats a valid Point.

 

[Coronis]

Same applies to Trumper, Gavaskar, Sobers, Akram, Kapil, Miller, Lillee, Gilly.. Etc

Sobers isn't a top 10 batsman or top batting allrounder based on his stats?

 

[ankitj]

And massive lol at someone thinking Richards belonged to different league of test batsmen than Gavaskar.

Gavaskar outscored Richards in 10 test matches( Two 5 test match series) when he played against WI pace quartet and Richards played only against kapil Dev in 1983

All-round records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo

All-round records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo

See the list of quality of bowlers they had to face
Bowling records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo

Why are you selecting just one year? Gavaskar and Richards had a much bigger overlap?

 

[sunilz]

Why are you selecting just one year? Gavaskar and Richards had a much bigger overlap?

Because he faced WI pace quartet during those 10 tests.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Same applies to Trumper, Gavaskar, Sobers, Akram, Kapil, Miller, Lillee, Gilly.. Etc

Not sure Sobers & Gilly fit in that comparison

 

[ankitj]

Because he faced WI pace quartet during those 10 tests.

OK, then why are you selecting that same 1 year for Richards? Was he facing the toughest Indian attack? Was Indian attack ever the toughest that Richards faced?

 

[trundler]

Eknath Solkar once outscored, outbowled and out-fielded Sobers. Doesn't mean much without context.

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

Sobers isn't a top 10 batsman or top batting allrounder based on his stats?

Nah.. I meant,His stats are the best, Impact even better.

 

[stephen]

Lmfao at the list of Australian bowlers in that game

Was there any other instances of all 11 players in a team rolling their arm over? The keeper got 10 overs. Must have been a spicy deck.

 

[Starfighter]

Was there any other instances of all 11 players in a team rolling their arm over? The keeper got 10 overs. Must have been a spicy deck.

1884 England vs Australia at the Oval, Murdoch's 211. English wicketkeeper Alfred Lyttleton bowled lobs with his pads on and took the last four wickets for 19. All 11 South Africans had a go against WI at St John's in '05 (Gayle's 317). Boucher dismissed Dwayne Bravo.

 

[stephen]

1884 England vs Australia at the Oval, Murdoch's 211. English wicketkeeper Alfred Lyttleton bowled lobs with his pads on and took the last four wickets for 19. All 11 South Africans had a go against WI at St John's in '05 (Gayle's 317). Boucher dismissed Dwayne Bravo.

Awesome. Learning about crap like this is one of the reasons I like this forum.

When I said before that the deck must have been spicy, it's only because it gave everybody runs.

 

[kyear2]

And massive lol at someone thinking Richards belonged to different league of test batsmen than Gavaskar.

Gavaskar outscored Richards in 10 test matches( Two 5 test match series) when he played against WI pace quartet and Richards played only against kapil Dev in 1983

All-round records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo

All-round records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo

See the list of quality of bowlers they had to face
Bowling records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo

Richards is one of a handful of 3 to 5 batsmen tops who isninngenuine contention to be seen as the best after Bradman. Sunny isn't in that group.

He is legitimate lock for a 2nd TAG XI and a great player no doubt, he is not in my opinion in the same league as Sir Viv

 

[kyear2]

Viv Richards in Asia
All-round records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo

Kohli in SENA country
All-round records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo

Kohli has more runs, more centuries, better average . First convince me Richards is better than Kohli . Forget Tendulkar and Gavaskar.

Assume this is your attempt at trolling, so will treat it accordingly and not even dignify it with a response.

 

[ankitj]

I do like the look of Kohli in SENA country table. Any batsman will be proud of that!

EDIT: and that looks even better for Tendulkar: http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...=3;opposition=5;template=results;type=batting

 

[sunilz]

Now that you mention it. Steyn replaces Lillee. Also thinking of replacing Proctor with Miller. In a 5 man attack with 2 spinners, he wouldn't need to bowl that much and he also solves the slip problem.

Umm

Spinning conditions XI

B. Richards.
L. Hutton
D. Bradman
G. Sobers
S. Tendulkar
K. Miller
A. Gilchrist
W. Akram
M. Marshall
S. Warne
M. Muralitharan

Miller can open with Maco and bowl in short bursts. This one better than with Kallis and McGrath?

Look who is talking about trolling. You pick a side for spinning condition and omit Imran khan . On top of that you pick 2 openers none of whom have played a test match in Asia.
In my opinion Viv Richards won't even make the 2nd best ATXI side if test match has to be played in Asia. So he is not in consideration for 2nd best test batsman after Don Bradman.

 

[vcs]

I do like the look of Kohli in SENA country table. Any batsman will be proud of that!

EDIT: and that looks even better for Tendulkar: Batting records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo

It's quite a brilliant record TBH. Already among the top 3 or 4 Asian batsmen ever, for centuries scored away from Asia. 10 centuries in 23 matches, averages around 50. And this is including that horrendous run in England in 2014.

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

Richards is one of a handful of 3 to 5 batsmen tops who isninngenuine contention to be seen as the best after Bradman. Sunny isn't in that group.

He is legitimate lock for a 2nd TAG XI and a great player no doubt, he is not in my opinion in the same league as Sir Viv

Hobbs, Sobers, Viv and Sachin

Only these 4 and Bradman can be rated indisputably more respected batsman than Sunny Gavaskar.

Lara, Hutton, Pollock, Headley, Hammond, Ranji, Trumper, Barry.. Etc are in Same League.