Test cricket is 'not sport'

[Scallywag]

Look at the last couple years since the Elite Panel was developed and you will see that your completely wrong.

Koertzen in the last two years 13 out of 25 games aganist Australia
Shepherd in the same time 13 out of 21 games aganist Australia

These are the umpires who have umpired half there games aganist Australia as i said twice. It pountless looking at their whole career cus the distribution of matches have changed completely since the 'Elite Panel' was developed and neatural umpires were introduced. I gather all stats that you are putting up are career stats.

maybe you need to look a bit deeper than that, There is only three other umpires that can umpire Australia so Koertzen and Shepherd make up almost 50% of the umpires available to umpire Australia.

 

[dudeurfriend]

I don't think Australia are the only team who get favourable decisions from the umpires. In the last ODI against Pakistan, 2 shockers were given and both went in favour of India.


But Geoff Boycott said something about how being an International umpire today means constant travelling. And some good umpires (he mentioned Peter Willey as an example) don't want to get into the international panel as they don't wanna stay away from home for that long. And he says that because of this, the International Panel is not exactly filled with the best umpires. They may be the best 'available' umpires but they are not necessarily the 'best' umpires..... The ICC needs to work something out about this.

Spot on..... Perhaps they must revoke the concept of not having home team umpires for test matches....

 

[chaminda_00]

maybe you need to look a bit deeper than that, There is only three other umpires that can umpire Australia so Koertzen and Shepherd make up almost 50% of the umpires available to umpire Australia.

You seem to forget that Hair just got on the panel, or got back onto the panel so most of the time they had netural umpires it been 6 that could umpire games aganist Australia. So that mean that their usually been 4 other umpire so those two should only be umpiring 1/3 of the games. Also they shouldn't be umpiring Australia so frequenty, as the ICC guildelines state.

"They are not allowed to umpire one team too frequently"​

The other umpires apart from Taufel, Shepherd and Kortzen all get their games shared around but these guys don't, if you look at their recent umpiring appointments. From some reason they umpire some teams more then other, which is unfair on the teams they don't umpire.

 

[Scallywag]

You seem to forget that Hair just got on the panel, or got back onto the panel so most of the time they had netural umpires it been 6 that could umpire games aganist Australia. So that mean that their usually been 4 other umpire so those two should only be umpiring 1/3 of the games. Also they shouldn't be umpiring Australia so frequenty, as the ICC guildelines state.

"They are not allowed to umpire one team too frequently"​

The other umpires apart from Taufel, Shepherd and Kortzen all get their games shared around but these guys don't, if you look at their recent umpiring appointments. From some reason they umpire some teams more then other, which is unfair on the teams they don't umpire.

I dont think you have the basis for claiming Australia or any other team gets better umpires and as has been proven over time each umpire is going to umpire all teams roughly the same % of time. Yeah sure you can pull out a section of time and say one umpire has umpired a team more than others but thats like saying Australia havent played SA in the last 3 years and all the other teams have and its not fair because we are missing out.

 

[marc71178]

All im should that it isn't fair that a umpire, gets half their games aganist one team and hardly umpires another team. It should be even like the guidelines say but it isn't is it.

Well you need to bear in mind that when SL play Aus (as they have done in what, 5 of those Tests), none of the Aussie's can umpire.

 

[marc71178]

Look at the last couple years since the Elite Panel was developed and you will see that your completely wrong.

Koertzen in the last two years 13 out of 25 games aganist Australia
Shepherd in the same time 13 out of 21 games aganist Australia

And coincidentally in that time, neither SA or England have faced Australia.

Funny that.

 

[chaminda_00]

I dont think you have the basis for claiming Australia or any other team gets better umpires and as has been proven over time each umpire is going to umpire all teams roughly the same % of time. Yeah sure you can pull out a section of time and say one umpire has umpired a team more than others but thats like saying Australia havent played SA in the last 3 years and all the other teams have and its not fair because we are missing out.

Playing one team over another team is different to umpiring as they are meant to be evenly distributed, which isn't the case for all umpires.

Same %, well i don't think umpiring half your matches aganist one team is not the same %. You can't argue the point that Shep and Rudi are umpiring Australia too much compared to other countries in recent times. You should never umpire one team in half your matches over any extended period, is not fair on the other countires. The teams they umpire should be even for all umpires not just a couple.

You seem to have this notion that the ICC or umpires can't do anything wrong and any constructive critism is not allowed. They seem to be protected species in your mind, even when they are not doing their job right, i.e distributing the umpiring appointment fairly to all countries.

 

[chaminda_00]

And coincidentally in that time, neither SA or England have faced Australia.

Funny that.

But have Australia played in half the matches that England or South Africa haven't been involved in. NO they haven't, so they should not be umpiring half their games.

 

[Scallywag]

You seem to have this notion that the ICC or umpires can't do anything wrong and any constructive critism is not allowed. They seem to be protected species in your mind, even when they are not doing their job right, i.e distributing the umpiring appointment fairly to all countries.

Thats you opinion, I just dont like how some supporters try push the blame onto the ICC and umpires when there is no justification for it. Its you who is claiming Sri Lanka gets bad umpires and Australia gets good umpires. But its only according to how you rate the umpires from the few matches you have watched. I have watched Australia get wrong decisions from the umpires and then read how posters claim all the decisions go Australias way because they dont deem bad decisions against Australia as match altering. Its pathetic how posters go on about the umpires when they have no idea what it is like out in the middle. Whats wrong with giving the umpire credit for the job they do. Is it so bad to show a bit of respect and admiration for the one of the toughest jobs in world cricket. The world is full of ungrateful people and you want to bag me because I'm grateful for umpires, its not me whos got the problem.

 

[chaminda_00]

Thats you opinion, I just dont like how some supporters try push the blame onto the ICC and umpires when there is no justification for it. Its you who is claiming Sri Lanka gets bad umpires and Australia gets good umpires. But its only according to how you rate the umpires from the few matches you have watched. I have watched Australia get wrong decisions from the umpires and then read how posters claim all the decisions go Australias way because they dont deem bad decisions against Australia as match altering. Its pathetic how posters go on about the umpires when they have no idea what it is like out in the middle. Whats wrong with giving the umpire credit for the job they do. Is it so bad to show a bit of respect and admiration for the one of the toughest jobs in world cricket. The world is full of ungrateful people and you want to bag me because I'm grateful for umpires, its not me whos got the problem.

Fair enough but i've provided justification for my reasons, which you wont take in for some reason. Maybe saying we get bad umpires was the wrong way to pharse it, i meant terms of allocation of umpires we get a raw deal, as i've justified earier. A few matches i watched, well considering i live in Australia i get to see the same amount as matches as you, as long as u have Foxtel, if you don't then i've proabably seen more games then you.

No idea of what it like in the middle you say; well in the comp i play on the weekend we umpire ourselves so i do have an idea of what it is like out there. No doubt it is a lot harder to umpire in Test Cricket, but in saying that it a lot harder to be a batsmen or bowler. I see no reason why poster can't comment on umpiring , just as much as they comment on batting and bowling. It is one thing being grateful for the they do, but it is another thing critising other poster just cus they different view on umpires or officials then you.

 

[marc71178]

But have Australia played in half the matches that England or South Africa haven't been involved in. NO they haven't, so they should not be umpiring half their games.

That's interesting, you've said that they've umpired over half Australia's games, yet you have quoted 2 different numbers for games.

The nature of the game is that if 2 series are going on at once, there's a lot of restrictions on which umpires can go where.

 

[chaminda_00]

That's interesting, you've said that they've umpired over half Australia's games, yet you have quoted 2 different numbers for games.

Where??

The nature of the game is that if 2 series are going on at once, there's a lot of restrictions on which umpires can go where.

There restriction but the amount of games that umpires official for all the teams should be even for all umpires. If it can be done for 5 out 8 Elite umpires why isn't it done for all.

 

[marc71178]

Where??.

25 or 21?

There restriction but the amount of games that umpires official for all the teams should be even for all umpires. If it can be done for 5 out 8 Elite umpires why isn't it done for all.

With back to back Tests that is impossible.

Finish a game on a Monday, fly 5000 miles and be fit to officiate on the Thursday?

Not likely.

 

[chaminda_00]

25 or 21?

I thought better off you, didn't you read the part that said Rudi umpires 25 games and Shep 21 games.

With back to back Tests that is impossible.

Finish a game on a Monday, fly 5000 miles and be fit to officiate on the Thursday?

Not likely.

Yeah but it is possible to reduce the amount of matches an umpire does for one team so it is even for all team. They dshouldn't umpire one team to frequenty and another team not frequently enough. If the ICC really followed their guildelines for umpiring appointments this shouldn't happen.

 

[marc71178]

It's impossible to do such a thing when series are taking place at the same time though.

Umpires would see their performances far more compromised by jet lag and the like.

 

[chaminda_00]

It's impossible to do such a thing when series are taking place at the same time though.

Umpires would see their performances far more compromised by jet lag and the like.

If it is possible to do it for 5 umpires, why not all 8 umpires.

 

[marc71178]

It's impossible to do it for all umpires because of the scheduling and the rulings over who can't umpire each team!

 

[chaminda_00]

It's impossible to do it for all umpires because of the scheduling and the rulings over who can't umpire each team!

But is it possible to stop an umpire having 13 games aganist one and 2 or 3 aganist another, YES

 

[Scallywag]

But is it possible to stop an umpire having 13 games aganist one and 2 or 3 aganist another, YES

Maybe its just forward planning, Australia play Eng next followed by WI then SA, NZ, SA, NZ, WI then Eng again meaning that the umpires from these countries and Aus will not be available.

So over the next two years Koertzen, Bucknor, Bowden and Shepherd will probably not umpire Aus.

Maybe you dont think its a good idea for SA, WI and Eng umpires to umpire Aus while they are not playing them but its the only way to make sure that they umpire all teams.

So as you can see it will even out over the next two years while Australia plays the teams from the countries these umpires come from.

 

[chaminda_00]

Maybe its just forward planning, Australia play Eng next followed by WI then SA, NZ, SA, NZ, WI then Eng again meaning that the umpires from these countries and Aus will not be available.

So over the next two years Koertzen, Bucknor, Bowden and Shepherd will probably not umpire Aus.

Maybe you dont think its a good idea for SA, WI and Eng umpires to umpire Aus while they are not playing them but its the only way to make sure that they umpire all teams.

So as you can see it will even out over the next two years while Australia plays the teams from the countries these umpires come from.

The two NZ series aren't Test Series their OD Series for the Chappell-Hadlee Trophy and hope it does even you cus the current situation is unfair on other countires.