Should Brett Lee be selected for the Ashes?

[Burgey]

i believe you'll find in this thread i did in fact say he would be your biggest threat, im not having a lend of myself,

post #388 http://www.cricketweb.net/forum/ashes-2009/41879-should-brett-lee-selected-ashes-26.html#post1942460
"
are you mad! brett lees your best bowler!

i guaruntee you hes the only one that scares the england batsmen. will be the quickest bowler of the series. did you ever see what shoab akhtar done to england?"

and just two posts after that an aussie saying

"Lee should be at the bottom of the pecking order out of the tour squad IMO. He doesn't have the work into him to think he'd improve on his pretty poor record in England. A few overs on a couple of T20 matches isn't enough. Needs to working his tail off in the nets and in the few tour games to get his mojo going.

If Lee or Clark aren't fully fit, we're much better taking McDonald to compliment Johnson and Siddle. "


I believe i am a genious?

[/:irony:]

 

[Top_Cat]

I believe i am a genious?

Oh the irony.

EDIT: Beaten.

 

[aussie]

Wow, you certainly have a very interesting take on the game of cricket. McDonald gains grudging acknowledgment when he takes a wicket, and plays no part in others getting theirs.

A wicket on a referral, which was given anyway beforehand, doesn't say much for the bowler?.

As i just said. SA where resigned to defeat chasing 454. They took 119 overs to score 291.Thats the same about of overs they took to chase down 414 in Perth.

A good reflex caught and bowled (another referral, so it probably doesn't say much for McDonald either) is a fluke.

All it was a a fluke. Do you remember Lee catch off Andy Blignauth in the 2003 WC. Was that a good ball from Bing?. Clearly it wasn't.

As i said before regarding his performance @ SCG. Given that the selectors had being stupid in the first two test in picking Hauritz as one of 4-main bowlers, which basically costed AUS the series. Picking McDonald to give the side 5-bowlers, aided the balance of the bowling attack, but inversely affected the balance of the batting since McDonald is not a test match #6.

Hilfenhaus or Nannes should have played in Sydney to give the attack 4 bowlers. Plus either Hodge, D Hussey or North should have played as the # 6 batsman.

The SA batsmen had to bow to the nagging 120kph pace of McDonald after a fiery Johnson spell. McDonald dismissed Kallis because he copped a hit on the jaw.

Ahh...its clear you didn't watch this test. Kallis in case you forgot as Amla, McKenzie, Smith, AB where blown away reducing SA to 6-3 (basically 6-4 with Smith out injured). He being the senior batsmen had to take up role to secure the innings, so when McDonald came on he didn't play him circumspectly because he couldn't score off him, but rather because it was smart tactical decision for the situation. Dumminy was the man playing the shots.

When Kallis was hit on face by Johnson & retired out. He was dismissed two balls into his resumption to a loose shot:

24.5 Johnson to Kallis, no run, do we have another injury here, not a pretty sight! Short on middle, struck Kallis on the jaw from under the helmet, he's in pain and is bleeding, the physio is out and it may take some time before he's back on his feet. Lethal delivery that.

South Africa 56/3 JH Kallis 22* (76b 5x4)

41.5 McDonald to Kallis, no run, good length on the off stump, defended off the front foot toward cover

41.6 McDonald to Kallis, OUT, Kallis goes! Landed on middle and leg and moved back in just a touch, Kallis gets on the front foot and chips it straight to Ponting at short midwicket who takes a sharp catch diving to his right

JH Kallis c Ponting b McDonald 22 (117m 78b 5x4 0x6) SR: 28.20

South Africa 104/6 JH Kallis 22 (78b 5x4)

Here is a link to Kallis innings in Durban.

The Aussie selectors got lucky selecting a guy who's done the same job in domestic cricket.

The role he played in domestic cricket is irrelevant. Such a player was NEVER needed. When AUS could have easily just picked 6 pure bats & 4 fast bowlers since the start of the NZ summer.

AUS got lucky with that selections, it really is very obvious. Do you disagree with the hypothesis that, if AUS where to tour SA for a 09/10 series with McDonald again as the part of 4-man attack, more of what occured in Capetown woulld be the trend of the series?. Surely not...

It is also pretty obvious also that AUS domestic competition that has been so strong for years. Is definately losing a bit of quality if McDonald is FC quality # 6. You would expect that in division 2 county cricket over here.

Wonderful analysis. Glad you took the time to read about the series.

Haa I actually watched every ball, except most of SA first innings when McGain was being smashed & i missed part of Johnson's hundred.

 

[tooextracool]

I don't think it would have been a good idea to give Johnson his first hit out in the First Test. I'd say they're looking at Clark or Hauritz now for that final spot and Hilfy may get a chance down the track. Personally I'd go for Clark unless Hauritz produces some sort of miracle.

Wow you aussies have one hell of a short term memory. I really cannot believe that anyone can can compare Hauritz with Clark. Somehow as an English supporter I really do hope that Hauritz takes every wicket to fall tomorrow, perhaps someone in the English camp needs to create a conspriacy to ensure that that is exactly what happens.

 

[Andre]

As i said before regarding his performance @ SCG. Given that the selectors had being stupid in the first two test in picking Hauritz as one of 4-main bowlers, which basically costed AUS the series.

1st Test, Perth. Jason Krejza, heard of him?

Anyway, back to topic. Would be a shame if Lee bowled his best spell of the summer vs England Lions.

 

[scorpiogal]

Oh the irony.

EDIT: Beaten.

 

[scorpiogal]

1st Test, Perth. Jason Krejza, heard of him?

Anyway, back to topic. Would be a shame if Lee bowled his best spell of the summer vs England Lions.

Back to topic: Yes, I believe Brett Lee should be chosen.

 

[Son Of Coco]

As i just said. SA where resigned to defeat chasing 454. They took 119 overs to score 291.Thats the same about of overs they took to chase down 414 in Perth.




All it was a a fluke. Do you remember Lee catch off Andy Blignauth in the 2003 WC. Was that a good ball from Bing?. Clearly it wasn't.

As i said before regarding his performance @ SCG. Given that the selectors had being stupid in the first two test in picking Hauritz as one of 4-main bowlers, which basically costed AUS the series. Picking McDonald to give the side 5-bowlers, aided the balance of the bowling attack, but inversely affected the balance of the batting since McDonald is not a test match #6.

Hilfenhaus or Nannes should have played in Sydney to give the attack 4 bowlers. Plus either Hodge, D Hussey or North should have played as the # 6 batsman.



Ahh...its clear you didn't watch this test. Kallis in case you forgot as Amla, McKenzie, Smith, AB where blown away reducing SA to 6-3 (basically 6-4 with Smith out injured). He being the senior batsmen had to take up role to secure the innings, so when McDonald came on he didn't play him circumspectly because he couldn't score off him, but rather because it was smart tactical decision for the situation. Dumminy was the man playing the shots.

When Kallis was hit on face by Johnson & retired out. He was dismissed two balls into his resumption to a loose shot:





Here is a link to Kallis innings in Durban.



The role he played in domestic cricket is irrelevant. Such a player was NEVER needed. When AUS could have easily just picked 6 pure bats & 4 fast bowlers since the start of the NZ summer.

AUS got lucky with that selections, it really is very obvious. Do you disagree with the hypothesis that, if AUS where to tour SA for a 09/10 series with McDonald again as the part of 4-man attack, more of what occured in Capetown woulld be the trend of the series?. Surely not...

It is also pretty obvious also that AUS domestic competition that has been so strong for years. Is definately losing a bit of quality if McDonald is FC quality # 6. You would expect that in division 2 county cricket over here.



Haa I actually watched every ball, except most of SA first innings when McGain was being smashed & i missed part of Johnson's hundred.

I did watch the tests. Obviously Kallis chose not to score runs off McDonald because that was better for the team. Could have scored runs whenever he wanted to no doubt.

As I said before, there's no guarantee any of the untested quicks you mentioned would have done better than McDonald. The Australian team was balanced better than in Aus and we won. Simply really. Put it down to luck if you like. McDonald wouldn't have been there if Clark or Lee were fit, but wasn't a bad option when they weren't. You can downplay what he did all you like. No one's saying he was leading wicket-taker or run-scorer. But he wasn't terrible either.

And yes, McDonald playing for one of the stronger teams in Australian FC cricket shows a lack of quality. A lack of quality other countries would love to have. Considering the likes of Boeta Dippenaar, Iain O'Brien, Chris Rogers, James Franklin, Owais Shah, Ramprakash etc are playing Div II it's not the rubbish dump you're making it out to be really is it? These guys aren't world beaters but they're not terrible. Wasn't Hughes just playing Div II? And of course, the pure quality that is Div I is highlighted by the world beating team England have had for the last few years.

What would happen in 09/10 would depend on the makeup of the rest of the attack and how he fitted in really. I don't think you can say he wouldn't bowl in the same manner. What he does isn't exactly rocket science. It's easy to say 'Australia got lucky' if you choose to ignore what actually happened.

 

[Son Of Coco]

Wow you aussies have one hell of a short term memory. I really cannot believe that anyone can can compare Hauritz with Clark. Somehow as an English supporter I really do hope that Hauritz takes every wicket to fall tomorrow, perhaps someone in the English camp needs to create a conspriacy to ensure that that is exactly what happens.

I think I need to open a reading lessons thread. Who was comparing Clark to Hauritz? 'Miracle' would suggest he'd have to do something remarkable like take 10/0 does it not? I would pick Clark if it was me, but stranger things have happened. The way Hauritz has bowled if he's in contention it'd be bewildering.

 

[tooextracool]

I think I need to open a reading lessons thread. Who was comparing Clark to Hauritz? 'Miracle' would suggest he'd have to do something remarkable like take 10/0 does it not? I would pick Clark if it was me, but stranger things have happened. The way Hauritz has bowled if he's in contention it'd be bewildering.

Hauritz could take every wicket for the rest of the game and it still wouldnt convince me that he was anything other than rubbish. What a joke bowler. Toss up between him, Cameron White and Ian Salisbury for worst spinner to play more than one test in all my years of watching.

 

[aussie]

Hauritz could take every wicket for the rest of the game and it still wouldnt convince me that he was anything other than rubbish. What a joke bowler. Toss up between him, Cameron White and Ian Salisbury for worst spinner to play more than one test in all my years of watching.

Bullet...rise up the guns to that

 

[Son Of Coco]

Hauritz could take every wicket for the rest of the game and it still wouldnt convince me that he was anything other than rubbish. What a joke bowler. Toss up between him, Cameron White and Ian Salisbury for worst spinner to play more than one test in all my years of watching.

Exactly, so we agree.

I just hope the Australian selectors think the same way.

 

[pasag]

Exactly, so we agree.

I just hope the Australian selectors think the same way.

 

[Son Of Coco]

Yeah, fair point!

 

[aussie]

Just wondering. Can Nannes still play for AUS?

 

[tooextracool]

Exactly, so we agree.

I just hope the Australian selectors think the same way.

Actually, I was being a little too harsh on Hauritz. He doesnt bowl the kind of long hops that the other 2 bowled.

 

[Son Of Coco]

Actually, I was being a little too harsh on Hauritz. He doesnt bowl the kind of long hops that the other 2 bowled.

He disguises his long hop well

 

[Golaxi]

w

1st Test, Perth. Jason Krejza, heard of him?

Anyway, back to topic. Would be a shame if Lee bowled his best spell of the summer vs England Lions.

i think you are under-estimating your own player. he is peaking at exactly the right time.

he is desperate to get back at the english on home soil after the last england home series. did you just see the anger in his face when the series was effectively over and he kept running in at full steam for god knows how long?

this is no co-incidence.

 

[Top_Cat]

Bullet...rise up the guns to that

Pew pew.

 

[Top_Cat]

he is desperate to get back at the english on home soil after the last england home series. did you just see the anger in his face when the series was effectively over and he kept running in at full steam for god knows how long?

You mean at The Oval when KP was giving him an object lesson in 'the faster you bowl, the further it goes.'? No thanks, Lee bowls far, far better when his nostrils aren't flaring anyway. If what you describe happens, Aus are in deep poo.