Indian Oversea test watch, how will they do?

[DriveClub]

Burgey said he lives in Balmain

 

[Black_Warrior]

Yeah more like it

 

[ImpatientLime]

And that is precisely why people are saying England is their best chance. English attack is reliant on just 2 bowlers - Broad and Anderson. That's just not enough to win you a 5 match series. You will need to sustain pressure for long periods of time. Are you going to have these 2 bowl all day non stop? The moment someone else comes on to bowl, England don't look like taking wickets.

Same attack failed to beat Pakistan at home over a 4 match series and that had Woakes bowling much better than he is now. You also have to factor in the fitness. Quite likely that Anderson might miss a game or two.

this argument hardly holds up considering england just won both of their home series this summer with a bowling attack carried by moeen and anderson.

moeen and woakes are very different bowlers in england.

 

[Woodster]

And that is precisely why people are saying England is their best chance. English attack is reliant on just 2 bowlers - Broad and Anderson. That's just not enough to win you a 5 match series. You will need to sustain pressure for long periods of time. Are you going to have these 2 bowl all day non stop? The moment someone else comes on to bowl, England don't look like taking wickets.

Same attack failed to beat Pakistan at home over a 4 match series and that had Woakes bowling much better than he is now. You also have to factor in the fitness. Quite likely that Anderson might miss a game or two.

Makes you wonder how England are unbeaten in home series' since that defeat by Sri Lanka in a two-Test series back in 2014!

 

[Black_Warrior]

Makes you wonder how England are unbeaten in home series' since that defeat by Sri Lanka in a two-Test series back in 2014!

Might have something to do with the quality of the opposition?
In 2016, they faced a number 2 ranked Pakistan and didn't beat them.

We are now talking about the prospects of facing the number 1 ranked team.


Anyway, not saying it's a certainty. It could very well be a repeat of 2014 and in my original post, I was clear that India could very well fall apart. However, at this moment, when you compare the 3 sides they will be facing,
Steyn/Rabada/Morkel/Philander/Maharaj

Steyn/Cummins/Hazelwood/Lyon

Anderson/Broad/Woakes/Ali

England is the best chance.

 

[Woodster]

Might have something to do with the quality of the opposition?
In 2016, they faced a number 2 ranked Pakistan and didn't beat them.

We are now talking about the prospects of facing the number 1 ranked team.


Anyway, not saying it's a certainty. It could very well be a repeat of 2014 and in my original post, I was clear that India could very well fall apart. However, at this moment, when you compare the 3 sides they will be facing,
Steyn/Rabada/Morkel/Philander/Maharaj

Steyn/Cummins/Hazelwood/Lyon

Anderson/Broad/Woakes/Ali

England is the best chance.

And in 2017 faced South Africa.

 

[Motorwada]

And in 2017 faced South Africa.

w/o Steyn, AB, Philander injured in a match etc etc

 

[Woodster]

w/o Steyn, AB, Philander injured in a match etc etc

Teams have players missing in almost every series! You can find reasons/excuses for any time not winning a series.

An unbeaten home record for three and a half years (even when we have injuries!) is still pretty good, and shows a lack of appreciation to suggest it's down to two bowlers!

 

[Black_Warrior]

^ I actually just responded to this in the other thread about Top 6 batting. SA's batting line up, at least the one they have had during that series is not all that.

 

[srbhkshk]

Most of the reason why England seems to be easier from a Indian perspective is that the Indian bowlers are very well suited for those conditions, purely from batting perspective England is easily the worst place for our batsman. So I suspect England is more of a boom or bust scenario and thus more of a chance than the other two which can go for a battle of attrition in which India will almost always come out worse off.

 

[Chrish]

England and SA have sporting tracks and there is always a chance for the opposition to nick a game or two.

Australian tracks on the other hand entirely suite their batsmen if not bowlers.

 

[Spark]

Teams have players missing in almost every series! You can find reasons/excuses for any time not winning a series.

An unbeaten home record for three and a half years (even when we have injuries!) is still pretty good, and shows a lack of appreciation to suggest it's down to two bowlers!

No Steyn, AB and Philander is a bit more than just "oh injuries happen". Take Root, Broad and Anderson out of the England side and see how well they would have done the last few years.

 

[Woodster]

No Steyn, AB and Philander is a bit more than just "oh injuries happen". Take Root, Broad and Anderson out of the England side and see how well they would have done the last few years.

Point being, South Africa are still a strong unit without such key players! So England are only good at home and are only unbeaten in over three years because the opposition always has key players out, or the opposition are not very good. Really.

 

[Woodster]

In those three and a half years, England have remained unbeaten against - India, NZ, Australia, SL, Pakistan, South Africa and West Indies. All down to two bowlers and a host of injuries to the oppo!

 

[CricAddict]

In those three and a half years, England have remained unbeaten against - India, NZ, Australia, SL, Pakistan, South Africa and West Indies. All down to two bowlers and a host of injuries to the oppo!

More than the two bowlers, the success can be attributed more to the 4 all rounders in the middle. England has been a strong all round team at home, just like India and Australia.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Point being, South Africa are still a strong unit without such key players! So England are only good at home and are only unbeaten in over three years because the opposition always has key players out, or the opposition are not very good. Really.

Huh, I never really thought about this but I guess you're right

 

[Daemon]

In those three and a half years, England have remained unbeaten against - India, NZ, Australia, SL, Pakistan, South Africa and West Indies. All down to two bowlers and a host of injuries to the oppo!

Yeah BW was wrong to say that England only have 2 bowlers at home.

However, an unbeaten home record of 3.5 years where they have drawn a series against Pakistan, drawn another one with NZ, dropped a Test to the WI and been bounced out by Ishant Sharma doesn't scream dominance.

Nobody's saying they're weak at home, but it's easy to understand why people may think that out of SA, Aus and England, India has the best chance to beat England. I don't necessarily agree with it, but surely you can understand why people think that way.

 

[Black_Warrior]

In those three and a half years, England have remained unbeaten against - India, NZ, Australia, SL, Pakistan, South Africa and West Indies. All down to two bowlers and a host of injuries to the oppo!

England is still a solid team at home. No one is doubting that. But the original point was that England is India's best chance this overseas season. Not a certainty that they would win. Yes I do concede that my assessment of English bowling attack was influenced a lot more by the current Ashes series and I failed to consider that they are a lot more potent in their own conditions.

But the original point still stands. Not one subcontinental team have ever won a series in South Africa or Australia
The best results achieved by India and Pakistan are 1-1 draws.

All 3 subcontinent teams have won a series in England. Pakistan's greatest Test team still lost 0-3 in Australia but managed 2-2 in England.

 

[vcs]

England is still a solid team at home. No one is doubting that. But the original point was that England is India's best chance this overseas season. Not a certainty that they would win. Yes I do concede that my assessment of English bowling attack was influenced a lot more by the current Ashes series and I failed to consider that they are a lot more potent in their own conditions.

But the original point still stands. Not one subcontinental team have ever won a series in South Africa or Australia
The best results achieved by India and Pakistan are 1-1 draws.

All 3 subcontinent teams have won a series in England. Pakistan's greatest Test team still lost 0-3 in Australia but managed 2-2 in England.

Was last year's team better than the Imran led sides that drew against 80s Windies home and away?

 

[TheJediBrah]

England and SA have sporting tracks and there is always a chance for the opposition to nick a game or two.

Australian tracks on the other hand entirely suite their batsmen if not bowlers.

Nah faster and bouncier wickets would suit their batsmen a lot more, as well as their bowlers.

England is still a solid team at home. No one is doubting that. But the original point was that England is India's best chance this overseas season. Not a certainty that they would win. Yes I do concede that my assessment of English bowling attack was influenced a lot more by the current Ashes series and I failed to consider that they are a lot more potent in their own conditions.

But the original point still stands. Not one subcontinental team have ever won a series in South Africa or Australia
The best results achieved by India and Pakistan are 1-1 draws.

All 3 subcontinent teams have won a series in England. Pakistan's greatest Test team still lost 0-3 in Australia but managed 2-2 in England.