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Happy with your current national side? (ODIs)

pup11

International Coach
Just felt a thread like this would be a good platform to discuss the state of one's national side and the changes that should be made, and with a eye on 2011 World Cup, would be interesting to see who are the players that most of the posters would like to see play through to the 2011 World Cup for their respective sides.

Starting with the team I support, which is Australia, have been kind of confused about what really is going on in terms of selection in the ODI side in the recent times, we have picked a lot of players who have just played a few games, and then for some reason have just vanished from the equation.

Despite all that, I think the current ODI team is making steady steps towards developing into a stable ODI unit, but still I think there is a lot of scope for improvement and this is the core group of 25 players, that I would like to see the selectors pick and choose and rotate players around from:

AUSTRALIA
1.Phillip Hughes
2.Shane Watson
3.Ricky Ponting (C)
4.Brad Haddin (WK)
5.Callum Ferguson
6.Mike Hussey
7.Cameron White
8.Mitchell Johnson
9.Brett Lee
10.Nathan Hauritz
11.Nathan Bracken
12.James Hopes
13.Peter Siddle
14.Ben Hilfenhaus
15.Doug Bollinger
16.Tim Paine (reserve wicket-keeper)
17.David Hussey
18.Brad Hodge
19 Brett Geeves
20.Marcus North
21.David Warner
22.Dirk Nannes
23.Travis Birt
24.Michael Clarke
25.Jon Holland/ Xavier Doherty/Steven Smith


If anyone beyond from this list performs exceedingly well then they should also be considered, but we surely should stick with a pool of talented players, rather than picking anyone who has a few good games in row at the domestic level.

Would also push Clarke out of that list and rather have someone like Shaun Marsh or Voges, that's of course if Clarke doesn't lift his OD form.
 

aussie

Hall of Fame Member
If its 2011, surely Marsh has to be considered. While Hodge ODI days are surely overs, throw in one of Vooges, Cosgrove, Hughes in there.

Plus Tait has to considered still ahead of one of Geeves, Hilfy, Bollinger if we are presuming he can get back to his 2007 WC level.
 

pup11

International Coach
If its 2011, surely Marsh has to be considered. While Hodge ODI days are surely overs, throw in one of Vooges, Cosgrove, Hughes in there.

Plus Tait has to considered still ahead of one of Geeves, Hilfy, Bollinger if we are presuming he can get back to his 2007 WC level.
How can you say that Hodge's ODI days are over, when he is about the same age as the likes of Ponting and Hussey, age should never be a factor when picking a national side, its the performances that should count, Hodge and the selectors aren't on the same wavelength, and that's pretty much the only reason why he isn't a part of the Aussie side, which is something very wrong and unacceptable.

Tait is one name that kind of skipped my mid, but I really don't know what the selectors are trying to achieve with him, he has been kept wrapped in cotton wool by them for a while now, only to play him in the Australian A side, but he is not even being considered for the Aussie national side, so unless he is struggling with fitness, don't know where his international career is heading atm.

Geeves, Hilfy and Bollinger all are good prospects for the future, and I know I might receive some flak for sticking out my neck and saying this at this point of time, but by working on a few minor things, Hilfy is someone who can prove to be very good bowler for us in the shorter formats as well.
 

Marcuss

Hall of Fame Member
1. Strauss
2. Davies
3. Trott
4. Pietersen
5. Collingwood
6. Flintoff
7. Wright/Mascarenhas
8. Broad
9. Swann
10. Seamer
11. Anderson

Could make a case for Morgan in the XI, especially after recent performances.
 

aussie

Hall of Fame Member
How can you say that Hodge's ODI days are over, when he is about the same age as the likes of Ponting and Hussey, age should never be a factor when picking a national side, its the performances that should count, Hodge and the selectors aren't on the same wavelength, and that's pretty much the only reason why he isn't a part of the Aussie side, which is something very wrong and unacceptable.
Exactly. But even if Hodge was still in the selectors favour i still wouldn't consider him for ODIs - just the test side.



Tait is one name that kind of skipped my mid, but I really don't know what the selectors are trying to achieve with him, he has been kept wrapped in cotton wool by them for a while now, only to play him in the Australian A side, but he is not even being considered for the Aussie national side, so unless he is struggling with fitness, don't know where his international career is heading atm.
Once he can stay fit in the upcoming domestic season, he should be in serious consideration for the ODI & T20 sides.

Geeves, Hilfy and Bollinger all are good prospects for the future, and I know I might receive some flak for sticking out my neck and saying this at this point of time, but by working on a few minor things, Hilfy is someone who can prove to be very good bowler for us in the shorter formats as well.
Dont see the big deal with Geeves, wouldn't have him near the ODI squad. Hilfy could come good in ODIs, bit currently i dont think he has the tools to be a ODI bowler. The Hoggard of AUS cricket.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
1. Strauss
2. Davies
3. Trott
4. Pietersen
5. Collingwood
6. Flintoff
7. Wright/Mascarenhas
8. Broad
9. Swann
10. Seamer
11. Anderson

Could make a case for Morgan in the XI, especially after recent performances.
Yes, in that number 7 spot ahead of Wright (promises a lot but yet to deliver) and Mascarenhas (doesn't even promise a lot and shouldn't be anywhere near batting at 7)
 

jondavluc

State Regular
Captain
Ricky Ponting

Vice Captain
Micheal Clarke

Openers

Marsh
Jaques
Hughes
Warner

All Rounders

Watson
Hopes

Wicket Keeper

Brad Haddin
Tim Paine

Fast Bowlers

Brett Lee
Mitchell Johnson
Nathan Bracken
Doug Bollinger
Shaun Tait
Peter Siddle
Clint Mckay
Ben Hilfenhaus

Middle Order Batsmen

Callum Ferguson
Micheal Hussey
David Hussey
Cameron White
Adam Voges

Spinners

Nathan Hauritz
Jon Holland
 

pup11

International Coach
Can't help but lol @ some of the blokes that got a mention before Voges.
I can't understand what all this fuss is about Voges, he has never been a consistent player at the domestic level and neither is he such a match winning player that one would ignore his inconsistency with the bat.
 
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Marcuss

Hall of Fame Member
Yes, in that number 7 spot ahead of Wright (promises a lot but yet to deliver) and Mascarenhas (doesn't even promise a lot and shouldn't be anywhere near batting at 7)
Yeah, I like Wright but not quite sure this is his time. He shows glimpses but until he can deliver on a consistent basis we should opt for an alternative. I personally wouldn't have too much of an issue with Dimi at 7, there is still Broad and Swann to come after him and should the top 6 do their job he can come out and do a pretty decent job at finishing the innings off. Then again that does involve relying on the top 6 to do their job.

Morgan at 7 just seems a little bit of a waste, if he was in the team ahead of Dimi I think we'd have to have a much more flexible batting order.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Morgan would bat at 5 or 6 in that case.

Mascarenhas has this so called big hitting, finishing, aura - but how often has he actually done it? I'd personally rate Broad as a better bat and Swann for that matter anyway.

Add in his bowling being completely innocuous and you have a modern day bits and pieces player.
 

Marcuss

Hall of Fame Member
Morgan would bat at 5 or 6 in that case.

Mascarenhas has this so called big hitting, finishing, aura - but how often has he actually done it? I'd personally rate Broad as a better bat and Swann for that matter anyway.

Add in his bowling being completely innocuous and you have a modern day bits and pieces player.
Bits and pieces is probably fair. I rate his bowling though even if he doesn't look like taking a wicket most of the time he offers good control in the middle overs, very rarely does he disappear to the fence for a shed load of runs.

What exactly do you want at 7 though?
 

pup11

International Coach
Exactly. But even if Hodge was still in the selectors favour i still wouldn't consider him for ODIs - just the test side
Why is that, Hodgey is still the most prolific OD batsman in Australia?

he can stay fit in the upcoming domestic season, he should be in serious consideration for the ODI & T20 sides.
Well, Tait is a match winner with the ball, but he's nothing short of a liability in the field or with the bat, on top of that, like we saw in the recent Aussie ODI season, he just can't string together consecutive games, and all this trouble would have been worth it, if he could have atleast managed to stay fit for a considerable period of time.

see the big deal with Geeves, wouldn't have him near the ODI squad. Hilfy could come good in ODIs, bit currently i dont think he has the tools to be a ODI bowler. The Hoggard of AUS cricket.
Geeves is a bloke who bowls at decent pace and swings the new white ball, and he is also a handy lower order bat, so he is a good prospect in that regard, as for Hilfy, unlike what you are saying, Hilfy does have the toys like a good bouncer, slower ball, yorker, but he has failed to use them properly, and on top of that his length has generally been poor, so its the execution of his skills that he needs to work on.
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
I can't understand what all this fuss is about Voges, he has never been a consistent player at the domestic level and neither is he such a match winning player that one would ignore his inconsistency with bat.
I don't really get this statement at all. I have a feeling you may be mixing his First Class performances and his OD performances up, but even that doesn't really make sense as, if he's anything in First Class cricket, he's at least consistent. While he's never quite lived up to the hype as a First Class batsman (though 4176 runs @ 39 is hardly rubbish - it's his conversation rate that remains the problem), his performances as a batsman in one day cricket have been exceptional. Last season in the FRC he averaged just shy of 45 despite only hitting one century - if that's not consistent I don't really know what is. Maybe you want him to do that four seasons in a row or something ridiculous, holding him to a standard you certainly haven't held Hughes, North, Warner, Ferguson or White to.

Well, funnily enough, he has anyway.

2005/06 - 49.83
2006/07 - 48.37
2007/08 - 51.00
2008/09 - 44.42

What I really like about Voges, aside from his god-like OD domestic stats, is how adaptable as a batsman he is. WA really struggled with the bat in the FRC last season and he took on the role of batting through the innings after top order collapses (and there were plenty) successfully, but he's also shown the ability to come in after a good platform and just blast the bowlers to all parts from ball one - like his 39 ball hundred on debut for Western Australia, his entire Twenty20 career and even his two games for Australia. He can do either job which makes him particularly valuable.
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Bits and pieces is probably fair. I rate his bowling though even if he doesn't look like taking a wicket most of the time he offers good control in the middle overs, very rarely does he disappear to the fence for a shed load of runs.

What exactly do you want at 7 though?
With Flintoff in the team at 5 or 6 anyway (at full strength) and Collingwood able to bowl a few, I don't think bowling's really a key issue from the #7 bat. What you need there is a batsman who can come in and hit from ball one. Wright and Morgan have both shown glipses of being able to do that.
 

pup11

International Coach
I don't really get this statement at all. I have a feeling you may be mixing his First Class performances and his OD performances up, but even that doesn't really make sense as, if he's anything in First Class cricket, he's at least consistent. While he's never quite lived up to the hype as a First Class batsman (though 4176 runs @ 39 is hardly rubbish - it's his conversation rate that remains the problem), his performances as a batsman in one day cricket have been exceptional. Last season in the FRC he averaged just shy of 45 despite only hitting one century - if that's not consistent I don't really know what is. Maybe you want him to do that four seasons in a row or something ridiculous, holding him to a standard you certainly haven't held Hughes, North, Warner, Ferguson or White to.

Well, funnily enough, he has anyway.

2005/06 - 49.83
2006/07 - 48.37
2007/08 - 51.00
2008/09 - 44.42

What I really like about Voges, aside from his god-like OD domestic stats, is how adaptable as a batsman he is. WA really struggled with the bat in the FRC last season and he took on the role of batting through the innings after top order collapses (and there were plenty) successfully, but he's also shown the ability to come in after a good platform and just blast the bowlers to all parts from ball one - like his 39 ball hundred on debut for Western Australia, his entire Twenty20 career and even his two games for Australia. He can do either job which makes him particularly valuable.
I don't know, maybe his stats are bolstered by the runs he scored in county circuit, because from what I've seen he hasn't really been all that consistent for WA, or maybe he just fails to score runs whenever I am watching the game.

I also think younger blokes like Hughes, Warner, Ferguson, White are not only talented, but they also have time on their side to improve and grow as players.
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
I don't know, maybe his stats are bolstered by the runs he scored in county circuit, because from what I've seen he hasn't really been all that consistent for WA, or maybe he just fails to score runs whenever I am watching the game.
Those are just his stats for WA, season by season, in one day cricket.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Bits and pieces is probably fair. I rate his bowling though even if he doesn't look like taking a wicket most of the time he offers good control in the middle overs, very rarely does he disappear to the fence for a shed load of runs.

What exactly do you want at 7 though?
Well with Flintoff, Broad, Swann, Anderson and another bowler, I'd take an extra batsman (maybe but nt necessarily one who can chip in a few overs) - when there's a perfectly serviceable bowler like Collingwood in the batsmen already, we don't need more options whereas that batting line-up is week.

Hence I'd put Morgan in.
 

Beamer

International Debutant
HAHAHA! How do I answer this one from a West Indian point of view? It will just be nice to have something approaching our best side on the park for the ODI's in Australia. I suppose our best pool of players for limited overs cricket would be something like:

Opening Batsmen

Chris Gayle
Andre Fletcher (can keep wicket if Ramdin doesn't improve)
Runako Morton

Middle Order

Ramnaresh Sarwan
Shivnarine Chanderpaul
Darren Bravo
Narsingh Deonarine
Lendl Simmons (can keep wicket as well)

All Rounders

Dwayne Bravo
Darren Sammy
Dave Bernard Jr
Dwayne Smith (He is back from Sussex now)

Wicket Keepers

Denesh Ramdin
Devon Thomas

Spinners

Nikita Miller
Suliemann Benn

Fast Bowlers

Jerome Taylor
Fidel Edwards
Kemar Roach
Ravi Rampaul
Gavin Tonge

As far as I can see those are our best players for the shorter formats at the moment. Of course the WICB may insist that the likes of Dowlin get rewarded for their loyalty but he should not be among our best middle order batsmen IMO.
 

aussie

Hall of Fame Member
HAHAHA! How do I answer this one from a West Indian point of view? It will just be nice to have something approaching our best side on the park for the ODI's in Australia. I suppose our best pool of players for limited overs cricket would be something like:

Opening Batsmen

Chris Gayle
Andre Fletcher (can keep wicket if Ramdin doesn't improve)
Runako Morton

Middle Order

Ramnaresh Sarwan
Shivnarine Chanderpaul
Darren Bravo
Narsingh Deonarine
Lendl Simmons (can keep wicket as well)

All Rounders

Dwayne Bravo
Darren Sammy
Dave Bernard Jr
Dwayne Smith (He is back from Sussex now)

Wicket Keepers

Denesh Ramdin
Devon Thomas

Spinners

Nikita Miller
Suliemann Benn

Fast Bowlers

Jerome Taylor
Fidel Edwards
Kemar Roach
Ravi Rampaul
Gavin Tonge

As far as I can see those are our best players for the shorter formats at the moment. Of course the WICB may insist that the likes of Dowlin get rewarded for their loyalty but he should not be among our best middle order batsmen IMO.
Whats Sameuls position now?. Plus got any links showing that is definate the Dwayne Smith is back?.

Loving the fast-bowling talent, looking forward to seeing them in AUS later this year.
 

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