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Bob Woolmer > Duncan Fletcher.

Barney Rubble

International Coach
Don't agree. Fletcher's selection record - ratio of duds to successes - is far better, certainly in the last three years or so. He also had a bigger turnaround to execute than Woolmer - England were a bit of a mess when he took over.
 

chaminda_00

Hall of Fame Member
TBH i wouldn't say Harmison is much more consistent then Akhtar, slightly but both are fairly incosistent at times.
 

chaminda_00

Hall of Fame Member
Barney Rubble said:
Don't agree. Fletcher's selection record - ratio of duds to successes - is far better, certainly in the last three years or so. He also had a bigger turnaround to execute than Woolmer - England were a bit of a mess when he took over.
Give Woolmer three years and he might do the same thing but then again Pakistan don't have as many preseved duds as a lot of their FC stats are inflated. And the ones that don't have great Youth records.
 

steds

Hall of Fame Member
Barney Rubble said:
Don't agree. Fletcher's selection record - ratio of duds to successes - is far better, certainly in the last three years or so. He also had a bigger turnaround to execute than Woolmer - England were a bit of a mess when he took over.
Just discussing this with young James90. He's had his fair share of duds, too. See Adams, Hamilton, Schofield, Afzaal, Dawson, McGrath, Rikki, Batty, Sidebottom, Ward, and now Udal, the ultimate joke.
 

Barney Rubble

International Coach
steds said:
Just discussing this with young James90. He's had his fair share of duds, too. See Adams, Hamilton, Schofield, Afzaal, Dawson, McGrath, Rikki, Batty, Sidebottom, Ward, and now Udal, the ultimate joke.
Fair point - but he's always realised his mistake and dropped them after a couple of games. And don't be criticising Chris Adams, I know a guy who knows him.

Actually, Afzaal's starting to come good a bit in the CC. Might not be such a dud after all.

And he does have a record of pulling players from nowhere to become stars - Tresco, Simon Jones, etc etc.
 

chaminda_00

Hall of Fame Member
steds said:
Just discussing this with young James90. He's had his fair share of duds, too. See Adams, Hamilton, Schofield, Afzaal, Dawson, McGrath, Rikki, Batty, Sidebottom, Ward, and now Udal, the ultimate joke.
TBF any 2nd spinner England pick is likely to be a dud, just like any all rounder Sri Lanka pick is doing to be dud. If you got nothing to choice from them really its not his fault.
 

Rob24

Banned
Barney Rubble said:
Don't agree. Fletcher's selection record - ratio of duds to successes - is far better, certainly in the last three years or so. He also had a bigger turnaround to execute than Woolmer - England were a bit of a mess when he took over.
Aftab Habib
Chris Reid
Ed Giddens
Darren Maddy
Chris Adams
Gavin Hamilton
Chris Schofield
Ryan Sidebottom
Ian Ward
Uzman Afzaal
Jimmy Ormond
Richard Dawson
James Foster
Anthony Mcgrath
Richard Johnson
James Kirtley
Ed Smith
Kabir Ali
Gareth Batty
Ricki Clarke
Martin Saggers
Shaun Udal
Jim Troughton
Alex Tudor
Grayson
paul Franks
Graem Swann
Ronnie Irani
Alan Mullaly
Ben Hollioke
Ashley Giles
Graeham Hick
Mark Ramprakash

And in case you didn't know...Pakistan were in a slight pickle too when Woolmer took over.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Well the last 5 on that list really smack of desparation.

Mullally was a superb ODI bowler for a spell.
Hollioake tragically died before we could assess him properly.
Giles is, regardless of what people say, England's best spin bowler.
Hick and Ramprakash were hardly his picks in the first place.

As for the rest of that list how many played more than a handful of International games?
 

Matteh

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
In reference to Rob24's list - -

Ed Giddens - took at least one 5for that i remember
Ian Ward - seem to remember him doing at least one innings of note
Jim Troughton - should have played a test not a one dayer
Alex Tudor - 99* a failure?
Ronnie Irani
Alan Mullaly
Ben Hollioke
Graeham Hick
Mark Ramprakash - these lot are a part of the great masses of nearly greats that appeared in english cricket in the last 15 years
Ashley Giles - Proven test player - esp. last Pakistan tour - batting is good enough to help win an Ashes test

I'm surprised that Martin Bicknell didn't appear on that list....
 
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greg

State Captain
Rob24 said:
Which makes the fact that he went back to them about 19 times each even more laughable.
Do you understand how the England selection process works? Not every player who plays for England can automatically be called a "Fletcher pick".
 

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