Days of Grace
International Captain
aye, lad, he weren't that quick were Barnesy. Briefly touching 120 km/h in today's metric system if you got 'im rilled up enough. But, he could make that ball break back like a motherf***ker.
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Who's the greatest left handed batsman of alltime?
- Thread starter BhupinderSingh
- Start date
SJS
Hall of Fame Member
Anyone who claims to have an answer to that is a pompous ass
There were some veryaggressive batsmen at that time too. The great Viv Richards is a prime example. I am not suggestingthat Hayden is as good as Sir Vivian but just that people did play in a similar ultra aggressive style and survive. I have no doubt that Viv would have added a few to his average if he was playing today.
The big difference in today's batting is the ease with which so many playersareable to play through the line with scant respect to the length of the delivery. This can easily be attributed to the true nature of the wickets and the lack of lateral movement from the bowlers in the air.
Its difficult to say which of today's batsmen, were they brought up on a diet of bowlers bowling swinging deliveries on helpful wickets, would have learnt to cope on those conditions too. But which batsmen would do better than others is a trifle tricky though it can be discussed. But to say by how much is to try to be too smart by half.
I prefer to follow the rule that you assess a sportsman by how he compares with his peers. If he is head and shoulders above his peers in his time and age, it is extremely likely that the same will be the case in another age. Hence my firm belief that Bradman would have had an unapproachable average today or in DrGrace's time the absolute figure might be lower or higher but he would have left his peers panting way way behind.
Hayden has to be assessed against his peers. He has to be assessed in different conditions as can be found today and against different bowlers. His flexibility and adaptability to different conditions and bowlers has to be assessed from his current record as against those of his contemporaries and he does perform pretty well.
I do suspect he would have a problem againstsomeone like Imran or Marshall simplybecause I think he has a problem playing the late swing at high speed from back of a length. Thats as faras I am willing to go.
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
Why not? Hayden's skill is punishing rubbish seam-bowling. If there is no rubbish seam-bowling around (which there wasn't much of in those days), we've seen that he rarely does much if anything of note.
As I say - I reckon he'd probably have managed 15 Tests tops and maybe just an average over 30 had he never played a Test after 2001.
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
Don't avoid the filter.
Days of Grace
International Captain
Oh, lark off!
archie mac
International Coach
He has hardly had a poor series, including facing Shoaib in fine form, he would have went okay imho
SJS
Hall of Fame Member
I too think he would have done well, but he would have been a better batsman too.
Ikki
Hall of Fame Member
Most of us are guilty of being conditioned by stereotypes. This affects our judgement sub-conciously - not to be confused with bas
Left handers are a species apart - particularly the left handed batsmen. They look so graceful. Their batting is so effortless. Many of them seem to caress the ball. The ball races off the bat after a mere nano second of contact almost without touching it. They are such artists. Its almost as if their batting is enjoyable even to the hapless bowlers. Never are they an 'affront' to the bowler as it were. By and large we would expect them to be lithe, lissom, almost slender even if tall and so on.
Hayden just doesn't fit that mould.
He is big as in BIG and appears BIGger. He is a giant with murder in his eyes. His demeanour is of a terrorist. He is a terminator. He slaughters the ball. He slaughters the ball and it explodes off the bat screaming blue murder. He scares the sh** out of us sitting thousands of miles away watching the small screen. He is not a guy you want to mess around with.
I suspect all this makes us somehow undervalue a great batsman. I have been guilty of the same myself. When he is on the rampage he is so damn domineering a 'flat-pitch' and'ineffective bowling' is what he forces us to think. And when he dies by the sword and walks off still looking like that murderer we think of the 'lumpen brought to book by superior intellect'.
For those who love stats , he has 27 hundreds in 89 tests - only Bradman and Tendulkar have got there faster, averages 53 plus in tests and has the second highest test innings ever to his credit.
I think he is a master batsman in his on way and I suspect many other batsmen we admire and call great must be looking at him at the crease when on song and wishing they could be a bit like him too.
I love watching him bat and can watch him everyday.
I agree with Mac he is a bit 'uncomfortable' in that list but how I wish he was playing for India
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
He's had several - he had as many as 4 in a row in 2004\05 and 2005.
Nonetheless, you don't need to - poor bowling has infected far more than not - of times seemingly everything - the last 6 years.
umair_103pk
Cricket Spectator
Man how you left Saeed Anwar out of the list he's still the record holder for highest score in ODI 194 against India.
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Okay, firstly, this thread is about test cricket. ODIs are completely irrelevant to test cricket - all the players on the poll had far better test careers than he (and, for the record, Lara was a better ODI player as well).
Secondly, since when did one score define your greatness? Great knock?: perhaps. Great player because of one knock?: no, not at all. He was a good player, but to demand his inclusion based on one innings in a format we aren't even discussing would be completely ridiculous.
archie mac
International Coach
A bit stiff, carried the Aussie team for a number of years, those two innings against the greatest pace attack in the history of the game says it all tbh
The Sean
Cricketer Of The Year
Indeed mate, two of the very best. Not saying I think he's the best leftie ever by any stretch, but if I was going to give a random vote I'd give it to him over Gower or Matty!
PhoenixFire
International Coach
I rate Langer as a better batsman than Hayden tbh.
Perm
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
AWTA.
archie mac
International Coach
Now there is an interesting question, I wonder how Langer would have gone in the early 70s and 60s when the players did not wear helmets. I can't think of any cricketer that has been hit in the head as much as the little fella