The Stokes and Woakes Thread

[Prince EWS]

Nah he isn't that much better a bat than Rashid if at all. He just gets shoved up the order a little artificially because Surrey have had glut of middle-lower middle order bats but no top 3 recently.

Yeah I'd trust Ansari's technique more up the order if need be but if we're talking about who's going to add the most value with the bat at #9 I don't think there'd be much to separate them. If anything Rashid might even be better at that.

 

[harsh.ag]

Is there any case for picking Woakes over Stokes if all three of Anderson, Broad, and Finn/Wood are playing?

 

[91Jmay]

Probably not, as a batsmen would be more valuable in that circumstance than another seamer and England think Stokes is a better batsmen.

 

[Prince EWS]

I reckon it'd be nuts to play Finn ahead of Woakes anyway. There's room for both Woakes and Stokes now unless the conditions dictate that more than three seamers would be a waste.

 

[Scaly piscine]

I think it's nigh on impossible to look at a pitch and say 4 seamers is going to be a waste. It may end up going that way, but to make that call before the toss is very difficult.

I honestly think Broad should be left out if it is a bunsen and you only want 3 seamers. Yes Broad is a bit better with a ball, but Woakes and Stokes are a whole lot better with the bat, and if seamers are only a peripheral factor then the batting differential becomes much more important.

Of course you could just pick Stokes and Woakes and Ansari, Moeen, Borthwick and Rashid as a bowling line up... that would interesting... T20-esque batting lineup.

 

[GIMH]

Leaving Broad out is absolute madness.

 

[honestbharani]

I think it's nigh on impossible to look at a pitch and say 4 seamers is going to be a waste. It may end up going that way, but to make that call before the toss is very difficult.

I honestly think Broad should be left out if it is a bunsen and you only want 3 seamers. Yes Broad is a bit better with a ball, but Woakes and Stokes are a whole lot better with the bat, and if seamers are only a peripheral factor then the batting differential becomes much more important.

Of course you could just pick Stokes and Woakes and Ansari, Moeen, Borthwick and Rashid as a bowling line up... that would interesting... T20-esque batting lineup.

I wish that side is picked for their first test against us...

 

[Dan Jamson]

a 6,7,8,9 of Bairstow, Stokes, Ali, Woakes is incredibly strong. If only we had a decent middle order before it.

 

[honestbharani]

Does batting for a long time hamper bowlers when they bowl? Serious question here..

 

[Scaly piscine]

Leaving Broad out is absolute madness.

Not really. He averages nigh on 40 with the ball in Asia and he's now a number 11 with the bat. If India are preparing the sort of 150 v 200 bunsens they had for South Africa then Broad bowling a few overs in the match with the new ball is a waste given he's not great with the new ball anyway and he offers nowt else. If you go 3 seamers and 2 spinners, where the spinners bowl 50-60% of the overs then Broad is the one to go. Anderson has a good record in Asia and the skillset for those pitches. Broad doesn't.

 

[marc71178]

We'll just overlook the fact that since 2012 he averages under 23 in Asia shall we? Clearly the games before that make more of a compelling argument.

 

[Cabinet96]

Broad has been unlucky in Asia really. Had fitness issues last time he toured India. only played one test in SL 2012. Was really good in his last two UAE tours. Think he has something to prove this winter but don't think you can say he's a dud in Asia yet.

 

[Cabinet96]

Woakes needs a big innings with the bat if he's to really overtake Stokes in the pecking order IMO.

 

[Scaly piscine]

We'll just overlook the fact that since 2012 he averages under 23 in Asia shall we? Clearly the games before that make more of a compelling argument.

Clearly including all of the games instead of cherry picking the ones you like makes more of a compelling argument.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Does batting for a long time hamper bowlers when they bowl? Serious question here..

Won't matter if we have 6 of them, can rest properly anyway.

 

[Dan]

1. Cook *
2. Ansari
3. Borthwick
4. Root
5. Stokes
6. Bairstow +
7. Ali
8. Woakes
9. Rashid
10. Broad
11. Anderson

#FullNSW

 

[marc71178]

Clearly including all of the games instead of cherry picking the ones you like makes more of a compelling argument.

How is looking at recent history less relevant then looking at something from 6 or 7 years ago when he was nothing like the bowler he currently is?

However, will remember your point next time you have a whinge about Durham players being overlooked so for someone like Borthwick we have to also consider his whole career, not just his last few seasons so you clearly agree that he isn't deserving of a call up...

 

[GIMH]

Broad is one of the best seamers in the world, and possesses the ability to run through a side like nobody else we have. The idea of him not playing in our most challenging series since probably the last away Ashes is bizarre. I'd like to think any selector who made such a suggestion would be sacked on the spot and deported. It's a non-starter.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Broad is one of the best seamers in the world, and possesses the ability to run through a side like nobody else we have. The idea of him not playing in our most challenging series since probably the last away Ashes is bizarre. I'd like to think any selector who made such a suggestion would be sacked on the spot and deported. It's a non-starter.

Yeah but the scrabble champ knows best, we should have enforced the follow on you know.

 

[Adders]

Pretty sure we all know by now that the correct answer to any cricket question/decision is the opposite of what Scaly says.