Watson's All-Time-Great Ashes Contest

[OverratedSanity]

I can only remember Gilly dropping catches at the very end of his career, and he gave it away very quickly once that happened.

Gilly was a very sound keeper. Keeping to Warne was probably the hardest task that a keeper's had to do in international cricket in the last 40 years, and Gilchrist did it well.

Yeah... He was very safe in general, and especially against Warne his keeping really impressed me. It's just that natural mentality... " Oh he was brilliant with the bat, so he obviously must have been a subpar keeper." He was pretty much the best keeper in the world throughout his career imo... Much better than guys like Boucher and co.

 

[The Battlers Prince]

I can only remember Gilly dropping catches at the very end of his career, and he gave it away very quickly once that happened.

Gilly was a very sound keeper. Keeping to Warne was probably the hardest task that a keeper's had to do in international cricket in the last 40 years, and Gilchrist did it well.

I actually found he was worse at the start and got better, but bad at the end too. Be that as it may, I think in an ATG side, I don't want to go in without the best keeper. Not Batsmen keeper. If that's Gilchrist fine, he's not IMO the best at the glovework. Better than a Wade by so far. But anyway, I know I'm never going to win this argument with so many fanboys

 

[OverratedSanity]

I actually found he was worse at the start and got better, but bad at the end too. Be that as it may, I think in an ATG side, I don't want to go in without the best keeper. Not Batsmen keeper. If that's Gilchrist fine, he's not IMO the best at the glovework. Better than a Wade by so far. But anyway, I know I'm never going to win this argument with so many fanboys

So fanboy=someone who doesn't share your opinion?

 

[The Battlers Prince]

So fanboy=someone who doesn't share your opinion?

Correct, I in this situation am a fanboy of proper wicketkeepers. Others are fanboys of wicketkeeper batsmen. Is that not the case?

 

[OverratedSanity]

Na... That would imply I think all wicketkeeper batsmen are better than pure wicketkeepers. Kamran Akmal, Brad Haddin>Alan Knott, Don Tallon

 

[The Battlers Prince]

Look, I'm not saying you can't choose Gilly. He was a great batsmen, and I was happy on many occasions to see him coming in at 7. Saved Australia on a number of occasions. And I choose Wally Grout (who I also wouldn't choose for this) because he was a larrikin like no other I've heard of, drinking beer on the field in some matches for Mackay between deliveries. But Grout along with the likes of Oldfield,Tallon, Marsh or even Healy. In an Ashes ATG side I'd get worried about missing a catch against some of those great POMs who could absolutely make the Aussies pay the price, scoring big runs only giving up a few chances.

 

[The Battlers Prince]

Na... That would imply I think all wicketkeeper batsmen are better than pure wicketkeepers. Kamran Akmal, Brad Haddin>Alan Knott, Don Tallon

Do you like Dhoni?

 

[OverratedSanity]

Point completely taken which is why I said :

I understand the argument for Knott but don't agree with it

Knott is far from a ridiculous selection

 

[OverratedSanity]

Do you like Dhoni?

Ew.
And surely you didn't take that post seriously?

 

[The Battlers Prince]

I've said my piece. Plus it comes down to is Gilchrist in this situation the best choice. Nothing to do with Akmal.

 

[watson]

Kumar Sangakkara appears to be a good bloke and should know what he's talking about because he's played a Test match or two. So I'm going with his opinion;

That his wicketkeeping was often overlooked is a compliment to his batting, and more importantly to his wicketkeeping. When your wicketkeeping is being noticed, there is normally a problem. Adam was an excellent wicketkeeper - maybe not in the same bracket as Ian Healy, but definitely one of the best going around in world cricket today. It would have been very difficult for him to step into Healy's shoes, but it was clear from the start that he was not trying to be another Healy; he was himself. Just as I have to keep to Murali, he had Shane Warne to keep to. When you have such great spinners in your side, it puts your keeping under scrutiny. You have to raise your keeping skills to match those of the bowlers you are keeping to. If you look at Adam's career, he has been consistently good, and that's exactly what you look for in a wicketkeeper.

'had Shane Warne to keep to'
'excellent wicketkeeper'
'consistently good'

Add 5570 runs, 17 centuries, and 26 fifties to the above plaudits, and that'll do me.

 

[The Battlers Prince]

Kumar Sangakkara appears to be a good bloke and should know what he's talking about because he's played a Test match or two. So I'm going with his opinion;



'had Shane Warne to keep to'
'excellent wicketkeeper'
'consistently good'

Add 5570 runs, 17 centuries, and 26 fifties to the above plaudits, and that'll do me.

A very good batsmen, and like I said, I was very happy to see him walking out on several occasions at 7 in the Aus side. But if you're going to refer to Sanga's statement as an argument against mine then why fully ignore the part of said article that backs up what I'm saying.
"not in the same bracket as Ian Healy"
And Healy has been compared to a lot of the other keepers that I already mentioned. I know I won't keep Gilly out of YOUR side. But in MY side he doesn't make it. That's all I'm saying.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Everybody knows Gilchrist isn't the best gloveman ever for Australia but to be fair to the bloke everyone they have tried since has been inferior apart from Manou who only had one game. The fact he could be argued about as a possible for the top 6 makes him a freak, ok he wouldn't make an all time top 6 but wouldn't be out of place being discussed he was that good. The fact his batting was far superior to any other Aussie keeper ever and his glovework wasn't as bad by the same margin compared to the greats means the all round package of Gilchrist is the best. Some may argue you should go for a better gloveman and I can see their argument but I think the pros outweigh the cons for Gilchrist.

 

[The Battlers Prince]

Exactly, it's all a matter of opinion, and mine is different to yours and most others. But it is what It is. After all, its just a fantasy series, whoever the gloveman is I think its others I'd be there to watch! DGB for one.

 

[Riggins]

If you don't think Gilchrist was a proper wicketkeeper then you're kidding yourself.

 

[hendrix]

Am I allowed to say that I don't think Healy was that good of a wicketkeeper?

Yes, better than Gilchrist by a touch. But not that great.

 

[The Battlers Prince]

In their early days Healy and Marsh weren't great. Overall it's considered generally that both were better glovemen than Gilchrist. Again though, I'm not going to change your opinion and you're not going to change mine while still admitting that I'm right that Gilly wasn't the best behind the stumps. I'd pick Tallon or if two spinners were chosen, either Grout or Oldfield. In the end I'm just offering a critique, and given what I've read from a considerable number of people here I don't expect I'll change anyone's view. But I won't be led blindly into thinking that Gilchrist is a shoe in, to any ATG side. Just my opinion.
I'm sick of this argument anyway, just looking forward to the next set of players.

 

[The Battlers Prince]

Am I allowed to say that I don't think Healy was that good of a wicketkeeper?

Yes, better than Gilchrist by a touch. But not that great.

Of course you can fancypants

 

[adub]

Gilly was an excellent keeper. Never been one who hasn't dropped a few, but he missed less than most. Excellent mover behind the stumps, being a bit taller and very athletic he had great reach and got to some that others might not have layed a glove on. If Marsh or Healy were better glovemen then it was only by degree. As a gloveman Gilchrist is no where near an embarrassment to be in their company. If he was Wade we wouldn't be having this conversation. Haddin isn't a bad keeper (not great obvs) but he's clearly a way below Gilly. You can argue that others are a bit better but it should be unarguable that he was top shelf.

Only then does the batting come into it - and there he blows away the opposition. He should have retired a bit earlier than he did because his last 18months-2years were an appreciable drop in standard, but for most of his career he was the best all round package ever to wear the gloves for us.

 

[bagapath]

gilly is a shoo in for any all time xi. top 10 keeper. top 20 batsman. top 10 cricketer of all time.