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Thread: ***Official*** New Zealand in Bangladesh & Sri Lanka 2013

  1. #721
    Cricketer Of The Year Bahnz's Avatar
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    Yeah, it's hard to escape the feeling that there was more than a touch of arrogance in the selection of this team. Like: these bangerz are rubbish, let's give Ish and Corey a debut in a match where they're guaranteed 4 or 5 cheap wickets without much effort.
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  2. #722
    Cricketer Of The Year hendrix's Avatar
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    I thought Anderson looked like he could take some wickets. Gets a hint of swing at a reasonable pace. His first over was much slower than his second over.

    Mominul didn't do anything but put away full tosses, short and wide balls, and half volleys. That's how poorly we bowled to him.

    Bracewell on very thin ice.

  3. #723
    Cricketer Of The Year hendrix's Avatar
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    Some other thoughts:

    • Any thoughts that Vettori wouldn't be a valuable component of the attack are now completely dispelled. Martin was terrible. Sodhi still looks 2 years away, despite the fact that he was the second best bowler on display.
    • Likewise, the idea that our pace attack is full of bowlers up to the task is incorrect. Bracewell et al may have a lot of potential but we just can't afford to give away that many runs. Southee and Boult are our only proven bowlers.
    • Bracewell has been underperforming for over a year now. Currently, Steven Finn is better than him. He needs to be dropped.
    • McCullum is coming dangerously close to not being amongst the top 6 batsmen in the country


    But this is a very valuable test to be playing for NZ. We need to learn these lessons ahead of the WI so that they can be corrected.

  4. #724
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    I agree Vettori is the best spinner we have right now, but judging the pace attack based on A) one session in which B) the only bowler who would definitely make the full strength attack bowled three overs is daft.

    And if Bracewell screws up in this series I would pick Milne for the West Indies. I would have picked him for this had timing allowed for it.

    Edit 1: Bracewell is a very frustrating bowler because his first two overs showed what he can do, but then he reverted to the bang it in macho crap and got smashed.

    Edit 2: If McCullum can't score runs batting in the easiest position there is, even on roads, then afaic he's getting dangerously close to specialist captain material. He was good on flat pitches in the home series against England but he needs to be more than a number six flat track bully if he wants to be taken seriously as a batsman again. It's disappointing because when he first began opening I thought he might have finally begun to stand up and make a position his own.
    Last edited by Flem274*; 10-10-2013 at 05:52 PM.
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  5. #725
    International Vice-Captain Mike5181's Avatar
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    Sodhi's markedly inexperienced, but I think we're kidding ourselves if we think he's going to learn much at all playing NZ domestic cricket. He's far better off learning in Bangladesh conditions. He shouldn't be starting, but meh.

    Dropping Wagner for Bracewell was a mistake, I don't care about the extra variation. I think it's a good argument to have when it's your third or fourth bowler, but the second best bowler in the squad should be an automatic pick. Bracewell's averaged close to 70 with the ball in the last 12 months.

  6. #726
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    Sodhi should be restricted to playing for New Zealand A at this stage, but that would be in an ideal world where NZC arranged lots of A cricket.

  7. #727
    International Captain straw man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnz View Post
    Well that was a pretty depressing couple of hours. New Zealand desperately need to crack this partnership early tomorrow morning or else the draw is pretty much guaranteed.
    I think this is very premature - we're still 360 runs ahead and in the subcontinent things can happen very quickly on days 4 and 5. I'm not concerned if days 2 & 3 are slow while teams jostle for position, as I think that's normal for a subcontinent test match too. Today our approach is just to be patient and disciplined, take opportunities and wait for mistakes to pick up 2-3 wickets by the 80-over mark, then we need 2-3 wickets from the second new ball, gradually work through the tail and aim for a 100 run lead. That puts us in a reasonable position to push for a result on day 5. Of course we're reliant on the pitch breaking up and becoming a little uneven in the last four sessions of the match, but if the pitch isn't going to do that then it was never likely to produce a result in the first place.


    Yes it's quite possible that Bangladesh will instead frustrate us, bat well to take their own 100 run lead and then put pressure on us to save the match, but right now we are in an above-par position so I think it's too early to bring out the black candles and orchids.

  8. #728
    Cricketer Of The Year hendrix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flem274* View Post
    Edit 1: Bracewell is a very frustrating bowler because his first two overs showed what he can do, but then he reverted to the bang it in macho crap and got smashed.
    I think we've gone past the point where it's a mindset problem or poor tactics. Bond would've been screaming in his ear for over a year now to pitch it up. I'm fairly certain he just lacks the control necessary for a test standard bowler. That will come after 1-2 years of domestic cricket. We can't afford for him to develop that in tests.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike5181 View Post
    Sodhi's markedly inexperienced, but I think we're kidding ourselves if we think he's going to learn much at all playing NZ domestic cricket. He's far better off learning in Bangladesh conditions. He shouldn't be starting, but meh.

    Dropping Wagner for Bracewell was a mistake, I don't care about the extra variation. I think it's a good argument to have when it's your third or fourth bowler, but the second best bowler in the squad should be an automatic pick. Bracewell's averaged close to 70 with the ball in the last 12 months.
    Yup.

  9. #729
    International Vice-Captain Mike5181's Avatar
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    I quite like this Bangladesh batting line up actually. It looks ten times better than it did a few years ago. They seem to be getting a few talented young players come through lately. It's just a shame about the bowlers.
    Last edited by Mike5181; 10-10-2013 at 06:17 PM.

  10. #730
    First Class Debutant Immenso's Avatar
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    Fairly harsh summary of Bracewell, was only 4 overs - and did include 'almost' 2 wickets.

  11. #731
    Cricketer Of The Year hendrix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Immenso View Post
    Fairly harsh summary of Bracewell, was only 4 overs - and did include 'almost' 2 wickets.
    that's true.

    We'll see what happens today. Will need to come out firing obviously.

  12. #732
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    I think we've gone past the point where it's a mindset problem or poor tactics. Bond would've been screaming in his ear for over a year now to pitch it up. I'm fairly certain he just lacks the control necessary for a test standard bowler. That will come after 1-2 years of domestic cricket. We can't afford for him to develop that in tests.



    Yup.
    Not neccessarily. I get the feeling Bracewell's bang it in method is a definite plan, since coaching staff have talked about him being the aggressive one iirc.

    That and well, you saw all McDermott had to do to improve Siddle...

  13. #733
    International Captain straw man's Avatar
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    This thread keeps coming back to the topic of our bowling attack. I think realistically in these conditions our wicket-taking was always likely to rest in order upon:

    Boult
    Williamson
    bangladeshi indiscipline
    attrition
    the new ball

    I just don't think any other bowler of ours bar Southee would make any real difference to our attack and I think there's a fair bit of wishful thinking in the idea that Vettori or Wagner would provide any noticeable improvement. They just happen to be missing out on criticism on account of not playing. Criticism based on a bowling effort that is 26 overs old and in its infancy; I mean no Bartin wasn't good but he's only bowled three overs and only the first was terrible.

    I will revise this opinion on the bowling attack slightly if Bartin or Sodhi or Bracewell concede a lot of runs (4.5+ per over) and thus actually detract from our attempts at attritional cricket, but other than that I really don't think this problem can be solved with a selector's pen.

  14. #734
    Cricketer Of The Year hendrix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flem274* View Post
    Not neccessarily. I get the feeling Bracewell's bang it in method is a definite plan, since coaching staff have talked about him being the aggressive one iirc.

    That and well, you saw all McDermott had to do to improve Siddle...
    Even if he was working to a back of a length plan he didn't hit that. He bowled wide long hops. He doesn't have the control to either pitch it up or hit a McGrath length. He just doesn't have the control.

  15. #735
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    I agree and disagree at the same time while there is no magic bullet, Boult-Bracewell-Anderson-Martin-Sodhi always looked and so far has started in horrific fashion, which is due in no small part to some good batting from Monimul.

    Edit @ Hendrix: well yes, but he has shown better control when he pitches the ball up, and to an extent in the past with the back of a length crap. Control isn't universal, and some bowlers find it easier to control what they're doing with different lines and lengths.
    Last edited by Flem274*; 10-10-2013 at 06:39 PM.



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