The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[harsh.ag]

The three great all rounders Sobers, Miller and Botham, all feature here. Imran can't be far behind, right? Think Hadlee and Dev to be above the fold here.

 

[smash84]

Imran wasn't too big on drinking. Women though was another matter

 

[The Battlers Prince]

Pfft what would you know about Imran Smalli

 

[Agent Nationaux]

Smali stalks him. Imran has now got a restraining order.

 

[bagapath]

one team for both tests and ODIs in same batting order...

Matthew Hayden
Gordon Greenidge
Viv Richards
Brian Lara
AB De villiers
Imran Khan (c)
MS Dhoni (wk)
Wasim Akram
Joel Garner
Muralitharan
Glenn McGrath

 

[smash84]

No need to have ABDV if Dhoni is in the team

 

[Teja.]

I was thinking about this today; At what point do we start having ABDv as a legitimate candidate to replace Gilchirst in the keeper-batsman role in a world XI? I think he's a lot more versatile batsman than Gilchrist and is somebody I like more coming in at No.6 regardless of whether the score is 60/4 or 385/4. Based on seeing them both play, I think he's also more likely to have success against high quality bowling in a variety of conditions. He averages 57 over 21 tests as the designated keeper and most of it has been against a high standard of opposition. Thoughts?

 

[Prince EWS]

I was thinking about this today; At what point do we start having ABDv as a legitimate candidate to replace Gilchirst in the keeper-batsman role in a world XI? I think he's a lot more versatile batsman than Gilchrist and is somebody I like more coming in at No.6 regardless of whether the score is 60/4 or 385/4. Based on seeing them both play, I think he's also more likely to have success against high quality bowling in a variety of conditions. He averages 57 over 21 tests as the designated keeper and most of it has been against a high standard of opposition. Thoughts?

Even if he retired tomorrow I think I'd have de Villiers down as the better batsman of the two - with the gloves or without. Gilchrist was just such a better gloveman though that de Villiers would really have to improve in that area; he'd probably find his way into the side on batting alone before he offered a better batting+keeping package than Gilchrist at his standard level of glovework.

I actually regard Andy Flower as a better batsman than Gilchrist but leave him out for similar reasons. Gilchrist's glove-work tends to be really under-rated in these discussions for some reason.

 

[Teja.]

Even if he retired tomorrow I think I'd have de Villiers down as the better batsman of the two - with the gloves or without. Gilchrist was just such a better gloveman though that de Villiers would really have to improve in that area; he'd probably find his way into the side on batting alone before he offered a better batting+keeping package than Gilchrist at his standard level of glovework.

I actually regard Andy Flower as a better batsman than Gilchrist but leave him out for similar reasons. Gilchrist's glove-work tends to be really under-rated in these discussions for some reason.

That's interesting. If ABdV goes down as the best bat of the Clarke-KP-Amla era but just outside Hammond-Hobbs-Sachin etc., you'd still Gilchrist for his superior keeping?

I rate Gilchrist as a test bat a lot less than you, I guess. I think he'd be one of the bats who'd suffer the most disproportionately from a hypothetical marked increase in quality of bowling across the world.

 

[Prince EWS]

I think he'd be one of the bats who'd suffer the most disproportionately from a hypothetical marked increase in quality of bowling across the world.

I agree really. I just don't think de Villiers's glovework would really cut it at that level either. I think what you rate higher than me is de Villiers's keeping.

 

[kyear2]

What I would say though is that de Villiars keeping is continuing to improve by leaps while his batting surprisingly isn't suffering as a result. If he can keep that up for a couple more years, he will have a shot to supplant Gilly and anyone else.

 

[the big bambino]

Gilchrist was one of the most destructive batsmen in cricket history. He could turn a tight game overwhelmingly in Australia's favour inside a session. At no point would I have DeVilliers, Flower, Knott, Ames, Lindsay or anyone over him and would be stoked if you had 1st chance to pick him in a draft but overlooked him.

 

[watson]

Here is John Arlott's "Desert Island" cricket XI. According to Arlott it is a team "of angels I will most enjoy watching in heaven."

01. Jack Hobbs
02. Mike Brearley
03. Viv Richards
04. Ted Dexter
05. Keith Miller
06. Ian Botham
07. George Brown +
08. Learie Constantine
09. Wilfred Rhodes
10. Jim Laker
11. Wes Hall
12th. Basil D'Oliveira

Cricketing pioneer John Arlott died 10 years ago | Sport | The Guardian

 

[fredfertang]

Arlott and Brearley got on extremely well, and indeed back in the 80s a book containing their conversations was published - I reckon JA only selected him for this exercise because he knew he'd be back in the pavilion almost straight away after going out to bat, and they'd be able to carry their convivial quaffing of a vintage Beaujolais

 

[smash84]

 

[watson]

Arlott and Brearley got on extremely well, and indeed back in the 80s a book containing their conversations was published - I reckon JA only selected him for this exercise because he knew he'd be back in the pavilion almost straight away after going out to bat, and they'd be able to carry their convivial quaffing of a vintage Beaujolais

Surely a worthy criteria for selecting an opening batsman?

George Brown seems quite a character as well as a reasonable bat - opened for England during the Gregory/McDonald series and averaged 50.

 

[harsh.ag]

Arlott and Brearley got on extremely well, and indeed back in the 80s a book containing their conversations was published - I reckon JA only selected him for this exercise because he knew he'd be back in the pavilion almost straight away after going out to bat, and they'd be able to carry their convivial quaffing of a vintage Beaujolais

Given that he would be watching from heaven (or wherever else he ended up), that would be a feat of notable achievement.

 

[Red]

Here is John Arlott's "Desert Island" cricket XI. According to Arlott it is a team "of angels I will most enjoy watching in heaven."

01. Jack Hobbs
02. Mike Brearley
03. Viv Richards
04. Ted Dexter
05. Keith Miller
06. Ian Botham
07. George Brown +
08. Learie Constantine
09. Wilfred Rhodes
10. Jim Laker
11. Wes Hall
12th. Basil D'Oliveira

Cricketing pioneer John Arlott died 10 years ago | Sport | The Guardian

My desert island XI would be something like:

Barry Richards
Brian Lara
Viv Richards
Mark Waugh
Victor Trumper
Colin Cowdrey
Adam Gilchrist
Wasim Akram
Dennis Lillee
Michael Holding
Bishen Bedi

 

[Gowza]

My desert island XI might be:

1 Barry Richards
2 Viv Richards
3 Brian Lara
4 Darren Lehmann
5 Mike Procter
6 Ian Botham
7 Adam Gilchrist
8 Shakib Al Hasan
9 Malcolm Marshall
10 Michael Holding
11 Courtney Walsh

 

[Coronis]

Mine would be:

Hobbs
Gilchrist
Richards
Pollock
Sangakkara
Sobers
Procter
Akram
Warne
Johnson
Barnes