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Thread: New Zealand doom and gloom thread

  1. #391
    State 12th Man Jezroy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flibbertyjibber View Post
    What about opening with Williamson, he basically is anyway as an early wicket goes and he walks in to face the new ball and looks the most accomplished player against it.
    I had wondered about this at ODI level as well as in tests.

    ODI's - Has the ability to bat through, just needs to work on turning the strike over better. Has opened in List A and T20's before.

    Tests - If he opened, who bat 3? Taylor seems to be the obvious choice, but still think he goes at the ball too hard, too early.

    But I like the potential of a batting line up of:

    Williamson
    Other Opener
    Taylor
    Brownlie
    Ryder (or Guptill/Latham/Broom in the mean time)
    McCullum
    Watling

  2. #392
    International Captain wellAlbidarned's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    He's looked very accomplished since his debut yet still averages around 33.

    He should be batting at 6 IMO
    It's just like high school cricket again. Every team has four number sixes and no openers.
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  3. #393
    U19 12th Man
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    watched a lot of bruce martin these last few months, conclusion, like jeets is not test standard.

  4. #394
    Quote Originally Posted by Jezroy View Post
    I had wondered about this at ODI level as well as in tests.

    ODI's - Has the ability to bat through, just needs to work on turning the strike over better. Has opened in List A and T20's before.

    Tests - If he opened, who bat 3? Taylor seems to be the obvious choice, but still think he goes at the ball too hard, too early.

    But I like the potential of a batting line up of:

    Williamson
    Other Opener
    Taylor
    Brownlie
    Ryder (or Guptill/Latham/Broom in the mean time)
    McCullum
    Watling
    As your best but still somewhat limited batsman Taylor's position should be the first one selected. Taylor at 3 will have you two down in 5 minutes, your best bat back in the pavilion. He needs to get in against an older ball as much as possible.
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  5. #395
    International Vice-Captain Maximas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lockton2skipper View Post
    watched a lot of bruce martin these last few months, conclusion, like jeets is not test standard.
    Clearly, Vettori is being flown in early which should be good, although his last test was ****.
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  6. #396
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jezroy View Post
    I had wondered about this at ODI level as well as in tests.

    ODI's - Has the ability to bat through, just needs to work on turning the strike over better. Has opened in List A and T20's before.

    Tests - If he opened, who bat 3? Taylor seems to be the obvious choice, but still think he goes at the ball too hard, too early.

    But I like the potential of a batting line up of:

    Williamson
    Other Opener
    Taylor
    Brownlie
    Ryder (or Guptill/Latham/Broom in the mean time)
    McCullum
    Watling
    Good luck trying to get Ross to bat any higher than 4 - fits into the same category as Tendulkar, Kallis, Pieterson, Crowe, (the list is endless) best batsman in any team gets to chose to bat where they think they will score the most runs.
    Fleming tried th approach, from 2004 onwards, of fitting the best 5/6 batsman in the side, rather than picking specialists for each position, it was one of several factors imo that lead to the dramatic drop off in our test performance.
    Take a look at Sri Lanka for example they have been through a long list of openers in the last 7-8 years but Sangakara or Jayawardene have not moved up the order.

    Personally I think if Brownlie wants to have a long term future in the side he should consider developing himself into an opener, with Taylor at 4 and McCullum at 5/6 his position will always be under threat from young talent coming through (ie Craig Cachopa), gifted strokemakers (Ryder, guptill), or the need to play a batting all rounder.

    His other option is to score buckets of runs and lock his spot in.
    Last edited by RxGM; 21-05-2013 at 04:27 AM.

  7. #397
    Global Moderator vic_orthdox's Avatar
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    Martin doing a bit of what we've seen from Haurtiz and Lyon in the past, contributing pretty damn well in first innings but then not getting the job done when he's expected to in the second. Looks like when he thinks the ball is supposed to be spinning, he bowls it into the wicket more, trying to rip it past the batsman, rather than with the same flight that he shows off when he thinks that spin won't be such a big factor.

  8. #398
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vic_orthdox View Post
    Martin doing a bit of what we've seen from Haurtiz and Lyon in the past, contributing pretty damn well in first innings but then not getting the job done when he's expected to in the second. Looks like when he thinks the ball is supposed to be spinning, he bowls it into the wicket more, trying to rip it past the batsman, rather than with the same flight that he shows off when he thinks that spin won't be such a big factor.
    Yeah spot on IMO.
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  9. #399
    International Vice-Captain BeeGee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    He should be batting at 6 IMO
    You could be talking about anyone in our top six, bar Taylor.
    Last edited by BeeGee; 21-05-2013 at 04:06 PM.

  10. #400
    International Captain hendrix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeeGee View Post
    You could be talking about anyone in our top six, bar Taylor.
    Very true, although a straight swap between Williamson and Brownlie would be ideal IMO.

    Brownlie to me looks more like a top 4 batsman, and no, that's not because he can't play spin.

  11. #401
    International Captain Bahnz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    Very true, although a straight swap between Williamson and Brownlie would be ideal IMO.

    Brownlie to me looks more like a top 4 batsman, and no, that's not because he can't play spin.
    Nah Brownlie's looked very average against the new ball on the few occassions he's been up against it. Look at his efforts against the new ball v SAF and England over the last few months. Never seems to last very long (only exception I can think of was his survival on the 3rd evening of the Auckland test).
    Last edited by Bahnz; 21-05-2013 at 06:37 PM.
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  12. #402
    International Debutant Kippax's Avatar
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    Yeah agree, wouldn't want Brownlie facing fuller and straighter lines, looking to get his cut away to a moving ball.
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  13. #403
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    Wasn't Brownlie in very early in the second test in SA when he scored his ton?

    BTW Brownlie is far more likely to score runs than domestic Ryder. I wouldn't be surprised if, like Bracewell, Ryder warms the reserves bench upon return for a period.

    This means Brownlie needs to keep scoring some ****ing runs of course, and since we're going to slow spinning conditions next tour his progress against non-Robbie Peterson or Monty Panesar spinners will be interesting to gauge.

    edit: I can't even remember if the Ryder discussion was in this thread or the tour thread, but oh well.
    Quote Originally Posted by Athlai View Post
    Jeets doesn't really deserve to be bowling.
    Quote Originally Posted by Athlai View Post
    Well yeah Tendy is probably better than Bradman, but Bradman was 70 years ago, if he grew up in the modern era he'd still easily be the best. Though he wasn't, can understand the argument for Tendy even though I don't agree.
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  14. #404
    International Captain Bahnz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flem274* View Post
    Wasn't Brownlie in very early in the second test in SA when he scored his ton?
    This means Brownlie needs to keep scoring some ****ing runs of course, and since we're going to slow spinning conditions next tour his progress against non-Robbie Peterson or Monty Panesar spinners will be interesting to gauge.

    edit: I can't even remember if the Ryder discussion was in this thread or the tour thread, but oh well.
    Came in after nearly 18 overs. Not ideal, but given that he was dealing with the kookaburra, it would've been considerably easier to bat by that stage. Then got out in the first over of the 2nd new ball.

  15. #405
    International Regular Mike5181's Avatar
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    From memory, McCullum and Williamson did quite well to blunt the new ball against Dale Steyn and company before Brownlie arrived at the crease. Philander surprisingly got a bit wayward when he came in as well. Although tbf, Brownlie did a damn good job of disrupting their attack, and never let them settle.

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