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Thread: ***Official*** South Africa in New Zealand 2012

  1. #751
    International Captain straw man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike5181 View Post
    I've been posting McCullum's stats for ages now. He's been woeful for ages now. I wonder if it was a tactical decision to keep the gloves in ODIs.
    So should he open, bat 3 or bat down the order?

  2. #752
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by straw man View Post
    So should he open, bat 3 or bat down the order?
    Well he definitely shouldn't bat three. He's a very boundary-reliant batsman who lacks the versatility and finesse to properly build a one day innings at #3 regularly, IMO. He either has to open with Nicol batting 3, or bat down the order as a finisher.
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  3. #753
    International Vice-Captain Howsie's Avatar
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    Brendon McCullum is one of the biggest frauds in ODI history. Minnow bashing king and even then his stats don't do justice to the reputation he has around the world. He's a bum and shouldn't be batting any higher than seven afaic.
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  4. #754
    U19 12th Man kiwiviktor81's Avatar
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    He's still riding high on that 158 in the IPL and his T20 century against Aussie. Another batsman in the true Kiwi mold, along with Taylor, McMillan, Ryder: bags of talent, not mentally able to execute good shot selection at the right times.


  5. #755
    U19 12th Man kiwiviktor81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post
    Well he definitely shouldn't bat three. He's a very boundary-reliant batsman who lacks the versatility and finesse to properly build a one day innings at #3 regularly, IMO. He either has to open with Nicol batting 3, or bat down the order as a finisher.
    What annoys me about this is that we have four guys who have opened last year or this year (Guptill, Nicol, Ryder, McCullum). Of the four, McCullum is probably the least able to hit the boundaries in the powerplay overs against a moving ball. I think he should definitely, as you said, bat lower, probably at 7, where he was going great before this opener idea came along.

    Taylor not being in the team makes it harder but I'd love to see an ODI top seven of:

    1. Guptill
    2. Nicol
    3. Ryder
    4. Taylor
    5. Williamson
    6. Franklin
    7. B. McCullum

    If Oram was fit I'd even consider Baz at 8.

  6. #756
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kiwiviktor81 View Post
    What annoys me about this is that we have four guys who have opened last year or this year (Guptill, Nicol, Ryder, McCullum). Of the four, McCullum is probably the least able to hit the boundaries in the powerplay overs against a moving ball. I think he should definitely, as you said, bat lower, probably at 7, where he was going great before this opener idea came along.

    Taylor not being in the team makes it harder but I'd love to see an ODI top seven of:

    1. Guptill
    2. Nicol
    3. Ryder
    4. Taylor
    5. Williamson
    6. Franklin
    7. B. McCullum

    If Oram was fit I'd even consider Baz at 8.
    I'd swap Williamson and Ryder for reasons I explained earlier in the thread, but yeah.

    It does potentially leave you a bowler short though; Nicol, Franklin and Williamson would have to make up ten overs. If Oram was fit as well I think Franklin would probably have to get the arse and McCullum would have to bat 6.

  7. #757
    U19 12th Man kiwiviktor81's Avatar
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    Switching Ryder and Williamson would be a good shout, but I have been traumatised by years of opening batting failures and consider Ryder more of a "third opener" in the likely case of a dismissal in the first two overs. Especially now that we're facing Steyn.

    But with Guptill and Nicol batting the way they are, Williamson might be better at No. 3, where he might have 40 overs instead of 48.3 to build an innings.

    Edit: I'd be happy with ten overs out of those guys, Franklin 5, Nicol 3 and Williamson 2.
    Last edited by kiwiviktor81; 24-02-2012 at 04:30 AM. Reason: mentioned bowlers

  8. #758
    International Vice-Captain Mike5181's Avatar
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    Nicol and Franklin in particular are capable of bowling a few overs.

  9. #759
    rza
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    The Kiwis crack me up when it comes to cricket. I get on really well with some of their players and coaching team and like them a lot but some of their antics on the cricket field make me laugh.

    If it was the All Blacks with all that strength and fire power you would have to take it seriously, but on the cricket field with their pop-gun attack, really, do me a favour. They are the poor man's Aussies!

    They may as well give up on all their intimidation efforts and just continue to play the game hard and do their best like they can. Especially after the third T20 game where they managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. If ever a team, as we would say in the trade, took the gas it was the Black Caps. If ever there was a choke this was it. Mind you I never heard that word mentioned post-match after the Kiwis surrendered a clear advantage that could have, and indeed should have, won them the series.

    The Proteasí fightback and spirit were good. They never gave up and their passion and intensity was evident right to the end. Thatís where the personality of AB de Villiers will be good for the team. They didn't play particularly well as a unit, but in the end they still came out on top when it mattered.

    Former ODI and T20 skipper Johan Botha was brilliant in this game. The last over of his spell set up the win for South Africa. Marchant de Lange bowled an excellent last over as well. Once the euphoria settles down in the South African camp after the unlikely series win they will reflect on areas of their game that need to improve considerably.

    New Zealand is an average team and they should under no circumstances run the Proteas close. Yes, they may win the odd game against South Africa at home but over a series the margin of victory for South Africa should be significant.
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  10. #760
    U19 12th Man kiwiviktor81's Avatar
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    Kepler's right about the intimidation thing. Not even Bond got lippy when he was chucking them down at 150+ so I don't see why Southee, struggling to reach 140, should have such a vocal opinion.

    I've never been to SA but the people I have met from there were mentally tough. I can't imagine some skinny kid from a place as unthreatening as Whangarei is going to achieve more than a few laughs in the Proteas dressing room afterwards.

  11. #761
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kiwiviktor81 View Post
    Edit: I'd be happy with ten overs out of those guys, Franklin 5, Nicol 3 and Williamson 2.
    Yeah it's a decent enough option if that's what your squad resources dictate but I think the big positive that should come out of having Oram, NcCullum, Bracewell and Mills is that you can play five frontline bowlers without having a rubbish tail. With Oram unfit I'd go with the team you named but with him fit I'd have him in for Franklin there.

    1. Nicol
    2. Guptill
    3. Williamson
    4. Taylor
    5. Ryder
    6. McCullum
    7. Oram
    8. NcCullum
    9. Mills
    10. Bracewell
    11. Southee

    12. Franklin

    I don't think that side should need any more batting that what it's got, personally. To keep Franklin in the side you'd need to leave Bracewell out.

  12. #762
    International 12th Man SeamUp's Avatar
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    When Ross makes his return to the ODI batting line-up for New Zealand, surely he should slot in at 3 and McCullum must go to 6 and try play a finishing role?

    Nicol
    Guptill
    Taylor
    Williamson
    Ryder
    B.McCullum

  13. #763
    International 12th Man SeamUp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post
    Yeah it's a decent enough option if that's what your squad resources dictate but I think the big positive that should come out of having Oram, NcCullum, Bracewell and Mills is that you can play five frontline bowlers without having a rubbish tail. With Oram unfit I'd go with the team you named but with him fit I'd have him in for Franklin there.

    1. Nicol
    2. Guptill
    3. Williamson
    4. Taylor
    5. Ryder
    6. McCullum
    7. Oram
    8. NcCullum
    9. Mills
    10. Bracewell
    11. Southee

    I don't think that side should need any more batting that what it's got, personally. To keep Franklin in the side you'd need to leave Bracewell out.
    Funny we should go for a similar thing. I just think that Taylor would be a good 3 as if an early wicket falls he can come in and take the game to the opposition. Don't think NZL should worry about 3 being to high for him...we're talking ODI cricket, white ball, good wicket, minimal sideways movement.

  14. #764
    International 12th Man SeamUp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rza View Post
    Kepler at his worst!
    Tbh I don't mind a few words and the Kiwis are entitled it as I like a bit of needle but only at the right moments.So yeah thats Kepler being Kepler. But sure,not after someone has absolutely smashed you for a 6 that stayed the same height for the majority of the field width.

    *cough cough* Timbo Southee
    Last edited by SeamUp; 24-02-2012 at 05:10 AM.

  15. #765
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    Meh, Southee can say what he likes, no matter his pace, if he performs well.

    All that will happen is Kepler's article will be nailed to the dressing room wall for extra motivation.

    Andrew Jones would score a ton then track the bloke down (didn't he do that in Australia once?).

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