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Thread: Are England The Real Deal?

  1. #136
    Hall of Fame Member Howe_zat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Got_Spin View Post
    When was the last time England were no.1 in tests?
    Would hazard a guess at early 70s. After SA's isolation, but before Lillee & Thomson.
    Last edited by Howe_zat; 12-06-2011 at 09:57 AM.
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  2. #137
    Global Moderator Spark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Got_Spin View Post
    Should be better though
    Well on potential he could be unstoppable but he's still pretty good.
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  3. #138
    International Coach GotSpin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Howe_zat View Post
    Would hazard a guess at early 70s. After SA's isolation, but before Lillee & Thomson.
    Fair amount of time in the wilderness.
    Mark Waugh
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  4. #139
    International Coach GotSpin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spark View Post
    Well on potential he could be unstoppable but he's still pretty good.
    He just goes through periods where he'll forget how to bowl. Though I presume his average will start to fall into the 20s soon


  5. #140
    Cricketer Of The Year wpdavid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Got_Spin View Post
    When was the last time England were no.1 in tests?
    Officially, I think it was in 1979. They'd beaten Aus home and away (albeit against their 2nd/3rd XI) and had drawn their last series in the WI. Of course we all knew that WI were the best in the world at that time, and I don't think the league table was in existence anyway. Their position was just one of those anomalies that showed up when the league table was back-dated.

    As has already been suggested they were probably number 1 after winning in Aus in 1971. But I think India took over for a while after winning in England in 1971 and the WI around the same time. Again, everyone would have known that SA were actually the best side in the world.

    The last time they were unquestionably the best test side in the world was around 1955-1958.

  6. #141
    International Coach GotSpin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wpdavid View Post
    Officially, I think it was in 1979. They'd beaten Aus home and away (albeit against their 2nd/3rd XI) and had drawn their last series in the WI. Of course we all knew that WI were the best in the world at that time, and I don't think the league table was in existence anyway. Their position was just one of those anomalies that showed up when the league table was back-dated.

    As has already been suggested they were probably number 1 after winning in Aus in 1971. But I think India took over for a while after winning in England in 1971 and the WI around the same time. Again, everyone would have known that SA were actually the best side in the world.

    The last time they were unquestionably the best test side in the world was around 1955-1958.
    Thanks for that.

  7. #142
    Hall of Fame Member Howe_zat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Got_Spin View Post
    Fair amount of time in the wilderness.
    They've had a good side between then and now, especially the '79, '85 or '05 incarnations, but never been quite as good as the top team, be it WI or Australia. The real wilderness years were the 90s, ofc.

    Edit: Also, what wpd said.
    Last edited by Howe_zat; 12-06-2011 at 10:12 AM.

  8. #143
    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Got_Spin View Post
    When was the last time England were no.1 in tests?
    Quote Originally Posted by Howe_zat View Post
    Would hazard a guess at early 70s. After SA's isolation, but before Lillee & Thomson.
    Quote Originally Posted by wpdavid View Post
    Officially, I think it was in 1979. They'd beaten Aus home and away (albeit against their 2nd/3rd XI) and had drawn their last series in the WI. Of course we all knew that WI were the best in the world at that time, and I don't think the league table was in existence anyway. Their position was just one of those anomalies that showed up when the league table was back-dated.

    As has already been suggested they were probably number 1 after winning in Aus in 1971. But I think India took over for a while after winning in England in 1971 and the WI around the same time. Again, everyone would have known that SA were actually the best side in the world.

    The last time they were unquestionably the best test side in the world was around 1955-1958.
    The final few paragraphs of the article actually answer that question
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  9. #144
    International Coach GotSpin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeraintIsMyHero View Post
    The final few paragraphs of the article actually answer that question
    Who are you again...Craig?

  10. #145
    Cricketer Of The Year wpdavid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeraintIsMyHero View Post
    The final few paragraphs of the article actually answer that question
    OK, OK I'll give it a read then ...

  11. #146
    State Vice-Captain akilana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spark View Post
    Err. Morkel is a good bowler.
    He's been good for only two series: england and india. He didn't really contribute to SA's undefeated run away from home.

  12. #147
    Cricket Web Staff Member gvenkat's Avatar
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    Ok. Let me try to understand this, England who conceded 400 to SL in the early part of the summer will roll over India eh? funny some of them saying 3-0.

    Sri Lankans are supposedly a weak batting unit compared to India and less said about the bowling the better. Yes the last session in Cardiff was just freak. The whole premise is based on England beating a weakend Aussie side and SL in the first Test. They did not even manage to beat SA in SA.

    An rejuvanated Indian side with Tendulkar, Sewag and Gambhir coming back and the bowlers if they select the right combo will beat England in England and this is during the latter part of the summer where India have historically done well. I will say 2-1 for India or a 1-1 result. It's highly unlikely India will lose this series.

  13. #148
    Hall of Fame Member Howe_zat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gvenkat View Post
    Ok. Let me try to understand this, England who conceded 400 to SL in the early part of the summer will roll over India eh? funny some of them saying 3-0.

    Sri Lankans are supposedly a weak batting unit compared to India and less said about the bowling the better. Yes the last session in Cardiff was just freak. The whole premise is based on England beating a weakend Aussie side and SL in the first Test. They did not even manage to beat SA in SA.

    An rejuvanated Indian side with Tendulkar, Sewag and Gambhir coming back and the bowlers if they select the right combo will beat England in England and this is during the latter part of the summer where India have historically done well. I will say 2-1 for India or a 1-1 result. It's highly unlikely India will lose this series.
    Firstly, who said 3-0? Other than a few jokey posts from GIMH or GF. In seriousness, almost everyone thinks this will be close at least.

    It's widely acknowledged that the Sri Lankans have a very good top 5, and batted reasonably well in the first innings on two rather flat wickets. The fact that England's bowling performance at Lord's was their worst in a year and they still got a first-innings lead and a winning position isn't to be sniffed at. Conceding 400 in the first innings is obviously not ideal but you can still win if you can beat that. India have been doing it that way for years.

    The last session at Cardiff was freakish but it wasn't a one-off. England have bowled out sides for under 100 5 times in the last year, and every side they've played against since mid-2009 have found themselves all out for under 150 at least once.

    What's this "weakened" Australia side? It was the Ashes for crying out loud. No-ones claiming they're as good as they were a few years ago, but come on, India have never won in Australia. And England absolutely schooled them over there. Got to be worth something.

    As for beating SA in SA, well, neither did India. It's not easy. England did hammer them by an innings in one match, though. And they've improved since then.

    If you think India are too good to lose in England, fair enough. No reason to deny they've got a formidable team, and I think it'll be close.

    But I've no idea why you feel the need to rubbish everything England have achieved over the last couple of years. It's been damn impressive.
    Last edited by Howe_zat; 13-06-2011 at 04:47 PM.

  14. #149
    Cricketer Of The Year zaremba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gvenkat View Post
    Ok. Let me try to understand this, England who conceded 400 to SL in the early part of the summer will roll over India eh? funny some of them saying 3-0.
    Not sure who here has been making either of those predictions.

    Quote Originally Posted by gvenkat View Post
    A rejuvanated Indian side with Tendulkar, Sewag and Gambhir coming back and the bowlers if they select the right combo will beat England in England
    Ok then.

  15. #150
    Cricketer Of The Year zaremba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gvenkat View Post
    Sri Lankans are supposedly a weak batting unit compared to India
    Not too much to choose between the Indian and SL batting line-ups in my view. I don't think that I'd be tempted to describe a line-up which includes Dilshan, Sangakkara, Samaraweera and Jayawardene "weak" by comparison with anyone.

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